Absent from the UK for more than 91 days?

[bart 0]

Pattaya People newspaper (23-30 June 2007) pages 24-25:

 

A report on a talk at the expats meeting about changes to UK tax rules contains the following item:

 

“One of the new rules is that you will no longer be eligible for free NHS treatment after an absence of 91 days….”

 

I find it heard to believe that after a single absence from the UK of 91 days or more you will no longer be entitled to NHS treatment ever again.

 

Maybe if you are absent more than 91 days for a number of consecutive years?

 

Or maybe you lose your entitlement until you establish UK residency again?

 

Any Brits know any more about this?

[papillon 695]

Doesn't sound right to me.

[HILLY 9]

Doesn't sound right to me.

Nor me.

[CheshireTom 1,377]

I spoke to my consultant regarding this issue yesterday because I was told last year that this was the new rule ................ which it is .......... sort off. .

 

There are a whole host of excemptions and qualifying statements in the rules.

 

In my particular case, I was covered by two excemptions ..... in receipt of a war pension and a as a former UK resident for 10 consecutive years who has been overseas less than five years.

 

The problem is finding someone in the NHS who knows what the rules are.

Edited June 27, 2007 by CheshireTom

[grs90 49]

The rules (from www.dh.gov.uk). Seems the key, if you are living in Thailand, is to declare you intend to become a permanent UK resident if you need treatment when you are back in the UK. Or burn your passport and claim political asylum and it is bound to be free then!!

 

 

Are you spending more than 3 months living outside the UK?

 

 

 

What if I should need hospital treatment?

 

Under the current Regulations, anyone who spends more than 3 months living outside the UK is no longer automatically entitled to free NHS hospital treatment in England. Whether you remain entitled depends on the nature of your residence abroad.

Extended holidays

 

If you are going abroad for a one-off extended holiday for a few months, then you will continue to be fully exempt from charges for NHS hospital treatment when you return to resume your permanent residence in the UK. The same will apply to your spouse, civil partner and children (under the age of 16, or 19 if in further education) if they are living with you in the UK on a permanent basis.

 

Once you are living here permanently you will become ordinarily resident and the Regulations will cease to apply to you. Your spouse, civil partner and child will also be considered ordinarily resident if they are living permanently in the UK with you. If they are not living permanently in the UK then the Regulations will apply and in order to be entitled to free hospital treatment they will have to meet one of the categories of exemption in their own right.

 

In common with those ordinarily resident in the UK, anyone who meets the criteria of ordinary residence or is exempt from charges for hospital treatment will have to pay statutory NHS charges, eg prescription charges, unless they also qualify for exemption from these, and will have to go onto waiting lists for treatment where appropriate.

Living in a bilateral healthcare agreement country?

 

If you have at some point lived lawfully in the UK for 10 continuous years, and subsequently choose to go and live permanently in a country with which the UK has a bilateral health agreement (including other European Economic Area member states) then when you are visiting the UK you will be exempt from charges for treatment for a condition which arises after your arrival here. Routine treatment of a pre-existing condition, or pre-planned operations etc, will be chargeable. This partial exemption will also apply to your spouse, civil partner and children (under the age of 16, or 19 if in further education) if they are living with you in the UK for the duration of your visit.

 

You will only be fully exempt from charges if you meet one of the other exemption criteria, for example because you are working abroad and have been doing so for less than 5 years.

 

For a full list of bilateral healthcare agreement countries, see the menu on the left-hand side.

Living in a non-bilateral healthcare agreement country?

 

If you choose to go and live permanently in a country with which the UK does not have a bilateral health agreement, then you will not normally be eligible for free NHS hospital treatment during a visit to the UK, no matter how long you may have lived here in the past. You may, however, be exempt from charges if you meet one of the other exemption criteria, for example because you are working abroad and have been doing so for less than 5 years.

Living in both the UK and another country?

 

If you spend more than 3 months living in another country on a regular basis each year, for example because you spend four months living in a second home during the winter but return to the UK for the rest of the year, then you may not be eligible for free hospital treatment while you live here. If the other country is one with which the UK has a bilateral health agreement then the partial exemption described above will apply to you. If the other country is not one with which there is a bilateral health agreement, then you will not be entitled to free NHS hospital treatment during the time you live here, unless you meet one of the other exemption criteria.

 

If you are in receipt of an UK state retirement pension then a different part of the Regulations applies to you. Please see the page 'Are you a UK state pensioner spending more than 3 months living outside the United Kingdom? '

Returning to the UK after a period of time living away?

 

If you go anywhere abroad for more than three months, either for a one-off extended holiday for a few months or to live permanently for several years, but then return to the UK to take up permanent residence here again, then you will be entitled to receive free NHS hospital treatment from the day you return. So will your spouse, civil partner and children (under the age of 16, or 19 if in further education) if they are also living with you permanently in the UK again.

 

Once you are living here permanently you will become ordinarily resident and the Regulations will cease to apply to you. Your spouse, civil partner and child will also be considered ordinarily resident if they are living permanently in the UK with you. If they are not living permanently in the UK then the Regulations will apply and in order to be entitled to free hospital treatment they will have to meet one of the categories of exemption in their own right.

 

In common with those ordinarily resident in the UK, anyone who meets the criteria of ordinary residence or is exempt from charges for hospital treatment will have to pay statutory NHS charges, eg prescription charges, unless they also qualify for exemption from these, and will have to go onto waiting lists for treatment where appropriate.

If I should need hospital treatment what documents will I need?

 

The Regulations place a responsibility on individual hospitals to determine whether, in accordance with the Regulations, a patient is liable to be charged for treatment or not. In order to establish entitlement, hospitals can ask you to provide documentation that supports your claim for free treatment.

Am I entitled to access primary care services?

 

Any person living here lawfully and on a settled basis is regarded as resident in the UK and therefore entitled to free primary medical services. On taking up residence in the UK it is advisable to approach a GP practice and apply to register onto its list of NHS patients. The practice may choose to accept or decline your application. An application may be refused if the practice has reasonable grounds for doing so, such as if you are living outside their practice area. A practice would not be able to refuse your application on the grounds of race, gender, social class, age, religion, sexual orientation, appearance, disability or medical condition.

Do I have to pay for emergency treatment if I have an accident?

 

Regardless of residential status or nationality, emergency treatment given at primary care practices (a GP) or in Accident and Emergency departments or a Walk-in Centre providing services similar to those of a hospital Accident and Emergency department is free of charge.

 

In the case of treatment given in an Accident and Emergency department or Walk-in Centre the exemption from charges will cease to apply once the patient is formally admitted as an in-patient (this will include emergency operations and admittance to High Dependency Units) or registered at an outpatient clinic.

Am I entitled to help with the costs of non-emergency NHS treatment?

 

For Information on help with health costs please see HC11 ‘ Are you entitled to help with health costs?’ that which is available from main post offices, social security offices and NHS Hospitals. HC11 is also available on the internet at

[Eneukman 1]

I've read this as well but can't recall the exact rules.

 

Certainly, indicating that you intend to become a UK resident should be sufficient for you to get the treatment you require free under the NHS. For fuck's sake illegal immigrants can get free treatment!

 

One danger I see in making a statement that you intend to become a UK resident should you need medical treatment whilst visitng relatives etc is that this could invalidate any claim that you now have a domicile of choice in Thailand. This could have dire consequences for thr wealthier members who have transferred the bulk of their funds offshore to avoid Inheritance Tax. If the Revenue decide that such a claim means that you are regarded as being domiciled in the UK (and I think it almost certainly would as you are efffectively saying that you no longer live in Thailand), your worldwide estate would be liable to Inheritance Tax rather than just your estate in the UK.

 

I don't intend to go into a lengthy discussion on domicile here, as it is a somewhat complex issue. However, when you leave a country in which you had acquired a domicile of choice (such as Thailand), you immediately reacquire your domicile of origin.

 

Alan

[pattaya1234 0]

.

Edited August 21, 2009 by pattaya1234

[Owen` 2]

Good luck on this guys. This is an absolutely huge issue in the US and it takes more than knowing the current rules. You have to keep an eye on what is being proposed and what is likely.

 

There are some retirees in the US for whom healthcare is 30% of their total cost of living (prior to age 65). Don't get caught by this stuff. Know your rules and what rule changes are pending.

[bart 0]

The key is to stay registerd with your GP.

 

If you dont see your GP for a couple of years you will be de-registered from that surgery and your medical notes will go into storage.

Thanks pattaya1234. Very helpful.

 

I'm just asking this as a long shot: any idea how my UK GP will react if, over a period of 12-15 months, I do not apply to his surgery as usual for my two-monthly regular repeat prescriptions?

 

When I get back, if he asks I was just going to say I was on a very long holiday.

[wacmedia 277]

Thanks pattaya1234. Very helpful.

 

I'm just asking this as a long shot: any idea how my UK GP will react if, over a period of 12-15 months, I do not apply to his surgery as usual for my two-monthly regular repeat prescriptions?

 

When I get back, if he asks I was just going to say I was on a very long holiday.

 

Hi,

 

I think you will be OK. I've had periods when I have not visited my GP for years. I was in there last week and the place was overrun by very pushy East Europeans and they had a booking system in 6 Foreign languages.

[CheshireTom 1,377]

Thanks pattaya1234. Very helpful.

 

I'm just asking this as a long shot: any idea how my UK GP will react if, over a period of 12-15 months, I do not apply to his surgery as usual for my two-monthly regular repeat prescriptions?

 

When I get back, if he asks I was just going to say I was on a very long holiday.

 

I asked the same question today at my surgery. My doc's response was to set me up for an appointment in Oct for regular tests that I have done and give me a script for 4 months supply of Cialis.

[Eneukman 1]

Thanks pattaya1234. Very helpful.

 

I'm just asking this as a long shot: any idea how my UK GP will react if, over a period of 12-15 months, I do not apply to his surgery as usual for my two-monthly regular repeat prescriptions?

 

When I get back, if he asks I was just going to say I was on a very long holiday.

 

Before I retired, I obtained a list of the prescriptions I had to take to keep my blood pressure under control. My records were then going to be put into storage, but I was assured that they cold be recovered easily enough should I return to the UK.

 

I had to tell my surgery that I was relocating to Thailand as I used to get called in once a year for a check up due to my blood pressure and they'd have wondered why I hadn't told them that I'd moved when their next letter was returned marked "Gone away".

 

Alan

[torrenova 644]

I've lived abroad for donkey's years but I don't reckon they could find a way of refusing ttreatment if I went back. Anyone with half an ounce of grey matter can get around any rules syuch as these.

 

I bet I'm still registered with my doctor I haven't seen for years. Just because you didn't get sick doesn't mean they can just delist you.

[pattaya1234 0]

I

Edited August 21, 2009 by pattaya1234

[wacmedia 277]

I don’t work in a GP surgery, and what I'm saying isn't definitive, but I have an understanding of NHS bureaucracy, and sometimes being economical with the truth can be helpful to both you and your medical professional.

 

Hi,

 

Good post and one people should absorb. The illegals/foreigners have people on the inside of these organizations who give them the inside info on how to deal with the System. It is only fair that if they are getting a service those of you who have worked and paid taxes all your lives should get treatment.

[friendlyric6411 0]

What a load off bollox , ever heard of the hipocritcal oath, cannot refuse anybody help in a british hospital.

[Eneukman 1]

What a load off bollox , ever heard of the hipocritcal oath, cannot refuse anybody help in a british hospital.

 

I have no doubt that you will be treated. However, if you no longer live in the UK, you may find yourself being presented with a bill for payment once you've recovered.

 

Alan

[Eneukman 1]

I've done a quick Google search and found this, which confirms what the OP said. It also says that some doctors are offering treatment regardless of the guidelines.

 

http://thisiscostablanca.adlibweb.com/content/view/353/102/

 

The article refers to people who have retired to Spain, but must, I would think refer to anyone who no longer lives in the UK.

 

Alan

[pattaya1234 0]

"

Edited August 21, 2009 by pattaya1234

[winner 0]

I am not a UK citizen but just had a friend return from the UK where he planned to visit family and get treated for a hernia that needed repair. He has lived here for over seven years now. He went to Manchester where he used to live and tried to get set up for the surgery. He was told that he would have to pay for it. He came back without setting it up and is paying for it in Thailand since it is cheaper here.

[neil324 0]

How is your GP going to know youve been away for 91 days or more

[Eneukman 1]

How is your GP going to know youve been away for 91 days or more

 

Before I retired, I used to get summoned to the surgery once a year for a check-up due to suffering from high blood pressure. Somehow I think hsving the letter asking me to report for my next check-up returned would give him a clue, particularly if I hadn't asked for a repeat prescription for 6 months or more!

 

Alan

[neil324 0]

Before I retired, I used to get summoned to the surgery once a year for a check-up due to suffering from high blood pressure. Somehow I think hsving the letter asking me to report for my next check-up returned would give him a clue, particularly if I hadn't asked for a repeat prescription for 6 months or more!

 

Alan

 

Yeh i see if your up and down to see him and then nothing for a few months. I can go years without seeing him at all

[jacko 8,578]

Yeh i see if your up and down to see him and then nothing for a few months. I can go years without seeing him at all

When I last went to see my doc he said 'I haven't seen you for a long time'.....'I know, I haven't been well' I told him'.....

 

 

Sorry....I'll log off now then.......

Edited July 9, 2007 by jacko

[chris_heaton 4]

How is the 91 days calculated? Is it all in one lump or throughout the year or in a 6 month period?

 

I am a diabetic and need a lot of insulin. I normaly get 3 months supply from my GP in England. I am in LOS for about 88/89 days and then return to the UK for about 14 to 21 days then back to LOS.

 

The last trip my doctor complained., He said I was living in Thailand and going to the UK for a holiday. He wanted to only give me 1 month supply of insulin and not three. I told him I had already booked the trip so had to go but when I come back I will stay in the UK longer. He accepted this and gave me the medicine.

 

Now I am worried what will happen when I go back again to England. I am never out of the country for more than 90 days at a time.

 

Chris

Edited July 9, 2007 by chris_heaton