Gotcha With Extension To Stay And Re-Entry Permit Valid Until Dates

[forcebwithu 4,856]

I just learned of a gotcha with the extension to stay and re-entry permit valid until date.

 

Earlier this year I got a Re-Entry Permit with a valid until date of 16 Nov, 2015, which coincides with the permitted to stay date of my then current extension to stay.

 

On 29 Oct, prior to my visit back to the States, I applied for and received a new extension to stay with a new permitted to stay date of 16 Nov, 2016. I then left Thailand on 4 Nov and returned on 13 Nov, 3 days before my Re-Entry Permit and current extension to stay was set to expire.

 

Upon clearing immigration on the 13th, I looked at my passport and saw an Admit Until date of 16 Nov, 2015. I immediately went up to one of the supervisors and pointed out the discrepancy in dates. His reply was to go to Pattaya Immigration on Monday.

 

So today I spent over an hour at Immigration while they passed my passport around to at least eight different people. End result is because I got a new extension to stay on 29 Oct, that basically invalidated my Re-Entry Permit on that day, even though it has a valid until date of 16 Nov. That also means my Non-O Visa is now kaput as I re-entered Thailand w/o a valid re-entry permit and I now have to go through the time and expense of applying for a new Visa.

 

While at Pattaya Immigration I also pointed out that even with an invalid Non-O Visa, BKK immigration should have given me a 30 day stamp, not 3 days. Their response, I could either go back to BKK to fix their mistake or slip them 500B and they'd take care of it Pattaya.

 

So let this be a warning to anyone contemplating a trip out of Thailand around the time their extension to stay comes up for renewal. You'll need to get a Re-Entry Permit at the same time or you'll be wearing my shoes.

[MM 6,562]

In a goofy way it sort of makes sense, especially if they want to be dickheads about it.

 

My sympathies!

[jacko 8,822]

When I read it I did think it was 'right'...... sorry it goofed up your later extension.

Obviously you cannot exit on a re-entry based on the old extension, and then return based per the new extension.

(I hope I got that right).

It would make sense to cancel prior (unused) re-entry permits on issuance of a new extension.

 

You have reminded me to watch out for something similar, I usually get a multiple re-entry permit straight away after getting the new extension.

[forcebwithu 4,856]

Since an extension to stay is for a period of one year, my error was thinking that meant the new one would start when the old one ran out. Lesson learned and I won't be making that mistake again.

[syd_tybil 70]

Thanks for taking the time to report your issues with immigration, my sympathies as well.

 

I know that you can apply for the retirement extension up to a month prior to its expiration, and I have always been leery of leaving and re-entering Thailand during that time until the new re-entry permit is issued. Apparently, there is a real issue to be aware of after all.

[tallguy 1,479]

 

I just learned of a gotcha with the extension to stay and re-entry permit valid until date.

 

Earlier this year I got a Re-Entry Permit with a valid until date of 16 Nov, 2015, which coincides with the permitted to stay date of my then current extension to stay.

 

On 29 Oct, prior to my visit back to the States, I applied for and received a new extension to stay with a new permitted to stay date of 16 Nov, 2016. I then left Thailand on 4 Nov and returned on 13 Nov, 3 days before my Re-Entry Permit and current extension to stay was set to expire.

 

Upon clearing immigration on the 13th, I looked at my passport and saw an Admit Until date of 16 Nov, 2015. I immediately went up to one of the supervisors and pointed out the discrepancy in dates. His reply was to go to Pattaya Immigration on Monday.

 

So today I spent over an hour at Immigration while they passed my passport around to at least eight different people. End result is because I got a new extension to stay on 29 Oct, that basically invalidated my Re-Entry Permit on that day, even though it has a valid until date of 16 Nov. That also means my Non-O Visa is now kaput as I re-entered Thailand w/o a valid re-entry permit and I now have to go through the time and expense of applying for a new Visa.

 

While at Pattaya Immigration I also pointed out that even with an invalid Non-O Visa, BKK immigration should have given me a 30 day stamp, not 3 days. Their response, I could either go back to BKK to fix their mistake or slip them 500B and they'd take care of it Pattaya.

 

So let this be a warning to anyone contemplating a trip out of Thailand around the time their extension to stay comes up for renewal. You'll need to get a Re-Entry Permit at the same time or you'll be wearing my shoes.

 

Can you do the conversion from the 30 days to Non-imm in Jomtien now. Last year the authorities had a clamp down on the activities at Jomtien immigration and you had to go to Bangkok to do the conversion. If this is still the case you will need to apply with 15 or more days left on your stay as they give themselves 14 days to make a decision.

 

Hope this works out OK for you in the end.

[Idefix 2,275]

Can you do the conversion from the 30 days to Non-imm in Jomtien now. Last year the authorities had a clamp down on the activities at Jomtien immigration and you had to go to Bangkok to do the conversion.

You can now do it in Jomtien, but Jomtien can't do it... They have to send your files to Bangkok.

You will still suffer the delay but no more the need to go to Bangkok...

[forcebwithu 4,856]

Can you do the conversion from the 30 days to Non-imm in Jomtien now. Last year the authorities had a clamp down on the activities at Jomtien immigration and you had to go to Bangkok to do the conversion. If this is still the case you will need to apply with 15 or more days left on your stay as they give themselves 14 days to make a decision.

 

Hope this works out OK for you in the end.

 

 

You can now do it in Jomtien, but Jomtien can't do it... They have to send your files to Bangkok.

You will still suffer the delay but no more the need to go to Bangkok...

 

I'm really in the dark on the hoops one needs to jump through to get a new visa. Because I don't know, I'm relying on the lady that handled the correction to my 30 day stamp to guide me through the process. And because I'm relying on her help, I bite my tongue while I sit in her office and witness her spending 90% of her working time watching TV, playing with her phone and chit chatting with her co-workers. That's what happened on Monday when I came back to collect my corrected passport. She hadn't done a damn thing with it during the 30 minutes I left it with her. So I had a seat and watched as another 15 minutes of my life was wasted until she finally gets around to opening the passport, drawing a line through the incorrect Admit Until date and rubber stamps a new date. BTW, this isn't a young person new to the working world, but an older lady approaching 40. The lady in question also wears a uniform with two stripes which implies a bit of seniority.

 

So the saga continues...

 

 

Today I made a trip to the US Embassy in BKK to get another income affidavit. On my return to Pattaya I made a stop at the bank to update my account book and then headed down to Immigration. There I presented the affidavit and bank book to the lady mentioned above. She had a look and pronounced them acceptable. She then asked for proof of address. Fortunately I came prepared with a copy of my True invoice for internet service, which was accepted a month earlier for the extension to stay. Well this time around the invoice wasn't good enough, instead I would have to provide a copy of my lease agreement. But she wasn't done yet with the hoop jumping. She then stated I would also need a copy of the house owner's Thai ID and a copy of the house book. No point arguing with her, she's holding all the cards and when she says jump, I smile and say how high.

 

I'm now working to get the needed docs emailed to me from my landlady who lives in Bangkok. It's looking like it'll be Friday before she can get them to me. So hopefully on Friday I can find out what the next set of hoops my unhelpful immigration official has in store for me.

[forcebwithu 4,856]

It just occurred to me that in all this back and forth with various immigration officials, I never once saw them reference a computer record of my visa status. Everyone did what I was doing, and that is looking at the date stamps and coming up with their own interpretation of my visa status.

 

The reason I started thinking about this is because I realized when one re-enters the country, the admit until date has always been the permitted to stay until date on the current extension to stay, assuming of course a valid re-entry permit. In my case that would have been 16 Nov, 2015 and that was what was stamped in my passport.

 

Any suggestions on how I can go about checking the computer record of my visa status? Since Pattaya Immigration didn't see fit to do this from the start, I'm not keen on asking them to do it now. Perhaps a visa service might be able to do this. Any recommendations?

Edited November 18, 2015 by forcebwithu

[MM 6,562]

Logically, since you returned before the previous extension expired, they should use that, since if they are saying the new extension takes precedence, then that means it has a term greater than one calendar year (one year and 3 days, in your case), and such a visa extension does not exist!

 

Good luck arguing that point though :

[forcebwithu 4,856]

Decided there was no need to argue the point, and no need to find someone to check the computer as to my visa status. Simplest was to just go ahead and get a re-entry permit for the extension to stay that took effect on the 16th. Figured they would have to access my computer record to enter the new permit, and if there was a problem with the visa they would let me know then.

 

As it turns out my morning visit to immigration was quick, painless and fruitful. I now have a new re-entry permit with no drama involved. The key was not asking any questions, just submit the documents and let the chips fall where they may.

 

Still can't wrap my head around how eight immigration officers turned a simple question about an admit date into "visa no good now". :

 

[biggles 509]

I never got a Retirement Visa extension in Thailand, even though I spent many years here. I was discouraged by the seemingly nonsensical hoops that BM would post about from IO and the differing requirements, sometimes within the same office. I would just get a multi entry non imm O in australia once every 12 months or so.

 

When I met my Filipina GF I decided to get a Retirement visa in the Philippines. What a difference !! I got a Lifetime Resident Visa and a Resident card, No exit/re-entry permits, no reporting, no extensions, just come and go as you like. I have never been to Immigration in six years. !!

 

The Thais certainly dont make retirement easy.

[jacko 8,822]

I never got a Retirement Visa extension in Thailand, even though I spent many years here. I was discouraged by the seemingly nonsensical hoops that BM would post about from IO and the differing requirements, sometimes within the same office. I would just get a multi entry non imm O in australia once every 12 months or so.

 

When I met my Filipina GF I decided to get a Retirement visa in the Philippines. What a difference !! I got a Lifetime Resident Visa and a Resident card, No exit/re-entry permits, no reporting, no extensions, just come and go as you like. I have never been to Immigration in six years. !!

 

The Thais certainly dont make retirement easy.

Well not as easy as the PI obviously, but at the moment I don't find it excessively onerous.

It is for those much older.

I am sure we can all come up with suggestions to make it better (for us).

 

I just wonder if one day they will 'tire' of all us old guys hanging around. Surely they will make it more profitable, ie expensive......

Just reading on Thai Visa how a man's wife was fined a large sum, as she had not submitted TM30s for many years.... just like me and many. The thought of a heavy fine hanging over me (and my belief they do enjoy the windfall) is a little disconcerting.

Edited November 19, 2015 by jacko

[forcebwithu 4,856]

Decided there was no need to argue the point, and no need to find someone to check the computer as to my visa status. Simplest was to just go ahead and get a re-entry permit for the extension to stay that took effect on the 16th. Figured they would have to access my computer record to enter the new permit, and if there was a problem with the visa they would let me know then.

 

As it turns out my morning visit to immigration was quick, painless and fruitful. I now have a new re-entry permit with no drama involved. The key was not asking any questions, just submit the documents and let the chips fall where they may.

 

Still can't wrap my head around how eight immigration officers turned a simple question about an admit date into "visa no good now". :

 

 

As noted in my earlier post I was able to obtain a re-entry permit. But even with that stamp in my passport I couldn't be 100% sure my visa was still good as there was a chance their computer system was dumb enough to allow issuance of a re-entry permit w/o a valid visa. The only way to be 100% certain was to travel out of Thailand and return. I just completed such a trip and I'm happy to report I now have an admit until stamp that matches my current extension to stay of 16 Nov, 2016.

 

It still boggles the mind that immigration officers that should know this shit almost managed to convince me I needed a new visa. Of course, never ascribe to malice that which can be explained by incompetence.