Airbus and Boeing products running behind schedule

[CheshireTom 1,377]

Perhaps the parts come free with a magazine, like Super Jet monthly ?

 

 

Nah, I think it's a bit like one of them Airfix models that you finish and wonder where the fuck the six extra parts were meant to go.

[eltib 54]

 

Nah, I think it's a bit like one of them Airfix models that you finish and wonder where the fuck the six extra parts were meant to go.

 

Heh,

 

What about the parts in a Revell Kit that didn't seem to exactly fit? That then have to be shaved down. When I was a kid, I hated Revell model airplanes because of the detail. Found myself literally having to force them in place. I loved Aurora kits because it didn't have this. No little men sitting inside airplanes or retractable LG and control surfaces. But Revell probably bought Aurora with Aurora's money like McD did with Boeing...

 

 

BTW guys... Took a look at my retirement account at Boeing, and I noticed it's the dreaded time of the year to sign the Code of Conduct. Glad I don't have to do that anymore.

Edited January 17, 2008 by eltib

[BigDUSA 71]

Boeing rolled out another delay yesterday in the first flight of its hot-selling 787 Dreamliner, and company executives left vague the latest goal for the first jet delivery to increasingly impatient airline customers.

 

It could easily be more than three months into 2009 before the first buyer gets its Dreamliner.

 

In a conference call Wednesday morning, executives outlined a revised timetable that postpones the 787's first flight a further three months, until June — fully 10 months behind the original schedule.

 

But Boeing isn't ready yet to commit to a new schedule for 787 deliveries, said Commercial Airplanes Chief Executive Scott Carson, because "we don't want to be in a position where we do this with you all again."

 

So this time, Boeing is taking pains to avoid over-promising and won't unveil a new timetable for flight testing and delivery of the first plane until "the end of the quarter," meaning March 31, Carson said.

 

In the meantime it will hold detailed discussions with its supplier partners, which Boeing blames for much of the Dreamliner delays, to ensure they can deliver on their commitments.

 

"We have resisted the temptation this time to make a broad and sweeping generalization about where we are" on the program, Carson said.

 

Despite the uncertainty, Carson insisted the mess on the 787 production line does not signify outsourcing gone bad. The new jet's global manufacturing plan is going to produce the game-changing aircraft Boeing has promised and airlines have ordered in record numbers, he said.

 

"Everything that we're seeing in terms of the health of the technology and what it's going to deliver continues to give us high confidence in this program," Carson said.

 

He got support from Henry Hubschman, CEO of airplane-leasing giant GECAS, which has not yet ordered any 787s.

 

"It's more important to get it done right," Hubschman said in an interview. "The worst thing that can happen to an airline is that you deliver [an airplane] and then you have problems with it. ... That's a disaster."

 

GECAS is still considering buying some Dreamliners, he said.

 

 

Airlines unhappy

 

Still, individual airlines will be hit. The Dreamliner's launch customer, All Nippon Airways of Japan, called the new delay "extremely regrettable," and an official told Bloomberg News in Tokyo that it may seek compensation.

 

Geoff Dixon, CEO of Australian airline Qantas, said the company will discuss damages with Boeing in the coming weeks because its low-cost carrier Jetstar has 15 787s on order, most of them set for delivery in the first year of production.

 

Adam Pilarksi, an aviation economist with consulting firm Avitas, said it could cost an airline $500,000 a month per airplane to substitute a leased wide-body jet for a Dreamliner it was expecting. Boeing will have little option but to pay up.

 

But aviation consultant Michael Boyd of the Boyd Group said the delays won't affect the fuel-efficient jet's long-term prospects. "It's a whole new airplane we're going to need with $3-a-gallon jet juice."

 

Boeing may also have to make advance payments to its major supplier partners, who will be squeezed for cash because they don't get paid until planes are delivered.

 

"The company most vulnerable to this is Spirit [AeroSystems of Wichita, Kan.], which has about $5.5 million per airplane that is delayed," said Paul Nisbet, an analyst with JSA Partners.

 

But Boeing has deep pockets. It doesn't expect a significant hit to the 2008 profit forecast, and 2009 profits should still be strong, executives said Wednesday.

 

Getting first plane done

 

The Boeing teleconference with media and Wall Street analysts gave details of the assembly delays on the first Dreamliner, which has turned into a fiasco.

 

There was some good news: 787 program chief Pat Shanahan said parts shortage are no longer holding up the first jet.

 

However, many of the parts are still sitting beside the assembly line. Mechanics can't install them because the work is all out of sequence.

 

"About a month ago, we had on airplane No. 1 over 10,000 fastener shortages," Shanahan said. "We're down to hundreds."

 

And out of several thousand system components that go into activating the airplane — including flap actuators, pumps, computers, and generators — only 27 are still missing.

 

"By Monday, we'll have all 27 of those parts," Shanahan said. "So if the airplane were available on Monday, with the wiring, the tubing and the ducting, we would be able to install all of those system components."

 

The next step on the jet would be to switch on the power and begin testing to ensure the systems work. That had been scheduled to start in late January.

 

Unfortunately, the airplane won't be available Monday because the wiring, tubing and ducting aren't fully installed. Shanahan said he expects the airplane's power won't be turned on until March.

 

The big issue now is out-of-sequence work, tasks the major partners were to do on the first airplane.

 

Boeing underestimated how long it would take its employees to complete that work, Shanahan said, and it has clogged an Everett production system designed to efficiently perform only final-stage assembly work and system tests.

 

Big headaches

 

Simply reconciling the engineering records from supplier partners with the reality of the assembled sections received has been "very onerous and time consuming," he said.

 

"We thought late December we would really turn the corner so we could start installing the systems racks and the wiring," Shanahan said. "We have not been able to finish that assembly work."

 

The critical task now, he said, "is getting all the partner supplier factories doing the work they were supposed to be doing and so we're doing the work we were supposed to be doing."

 

That's what will determine if the follow-on airplanes can be built much more quickly than the first one.

 

After the first 787 flies, five others must be swiftly rolled out to do full flight tests and certify the jet before delivery can start.

 

"I can see a path forward based on how much work we've completed," said Shanahan. "I'm confident that we've got the right plan and it's really about focus and execution."

 

Carson acknowledged Boeing had offered similar assurances last fall.

 

"I know our credibility is also being tested on this program," said Carson, "It is up to us to deliver."

[CheshireTom 1,377]

Oh dear!!! 787 delayed again!!! And will this be the last delay announced? probably not.

 

And yet again Boeing is trying to blame everyone else but themselves.

 

It is 5 months since the 787 was unveiled to the public and they still haven't got all the parts to finish the first one.

 

As BigD kindly posted .................

 

and company executives left vague the latest goal for the first jet delivery to increasingly impatient airline customers.

 

The latest 3 month delay is to the first flight only and basically they haven't got a clue how long it will take to get certification and get the thing to their customers.

 

One of the major problems they now have is that the first couple of test aircraft are being put together by Boeing rather than their partners so they can only achieve certification for that particular production process. Much the same as Airbus had to do with the A380 and build the first 26 aircraft differently from the subsequent builds.

[TheFiend 1,181]

After the first 787 flies, five others must be swiftly rolled out to do full flight tests and certify the jet before delivery can start.

 

And the big question is - How long will it take Boeing to get the NightmareLiner certified????

 

I don't think anybody can answer that question.... not even Boeing.

[CheshireTom 1,377]

And the big question is - How long will it take Boeing to get the NightmareLiner certified????

 

I don't think anybody can answer that question.... not even Boeing.

 

It may be that they will come to regret scheduling so many aircraft for delivery in the first two years .......

 

 

In a conference call with analysts yesterday, Boeing executives said they did not anticipate the delay having a significant effect on 2008 earnings, though the company was still assessing how it would affect earnings in 2009, the first year when Boeing would have to pay penalties to airlines.

 

But Peter Arment, an analyst with American Technology Research, estimated in a report to investors Wednesday that Boeing may have to pay penalties to 40 airlines totaling more than $1bn (£500m).

[eltib 54]

Tom,

 

it sure looks like the 170,000+ employees left at Boeing won't be getting 20 days of extra pay this year for failing to meet their targets. Look at the end of the month on the EIP to find out.

 

I have a second interview coming up this week for the University of California Irvine for a same position that I did in Boeing. Pays about $2.25 per hour less, but better benefits, and more job security.

 

I also found out about the Northrop job that fucking Indian snake charmer was told by Northrop management that "they felt I was not qualified for the job", yet he continued to tell me they were impressed with me, and continued to put me in for it.

 

Glad I got that solved with a nice gal from a different agency in Rhode Island who understands English. She talked to Northrop Management , and Northrop was really nice and apologized to me for having to put up with the snake charmer.

 

 

Here's the letter I wrote the snake charmer's boss.

 

Mr. Clark,

 

As of today I've have found out from another agency why the Northrop position was closed out on me. It wasn't a matter of a freeze or some HR directive from Northrop Grumman. What I want to know is why Rohit Arora continued to pursue securing me in a position that I was disqualified for after September 20, 2007? Mr. Arora should have not contacted me on October 15, 2007 to raise my hopes up that I had a chance of getting the job with Northrop Grumman. I have the email record to prove my point now. Unfortunately you will not see it until others do.

 

This is where I raise a "question of ethics." So what if Mr. Arora denied everything detailing the bidding process where he told me I'd get $23 per hour, yet he bid me in at $26 per hour. That's moot here say now. I know very well the reason why these H1B Visas are granted. It isn't a matter that Mr. Arora or people from India are smarter than American citizens. It's a matter that you don't want to pay Americans what they are really worth.

 

I have my cell and Vonage records showing communication between Mr. Arora and I, and plan on pursuing this matter further, through CNN and other news agencies, along with my Congressman. Though I expect with my representative's ethical lapses, nothing will be done in the near term, or maybe even the long term on his end. When that point and time comes I'll deal with him, because I've found enough dirt on him.

Edited January 19, 2008 by eltib

[CheshireTom 1,377]

eltib,

 

The good news as far as the Brits/Euros are concerned is that Bangkok Airways has ordered/agreed to buy the A350XWB to set up its long haul routes to Europe. A few years down the line and a lot can change but a nice option from Thai/EVA to look forward to.

[wacmedia 277]

eltib,

 

The good news as far as the Brits/Euros are concerned is that Bangkok Airways has ordered/agreed to buy the A350XWB to set up its long haul routes to Europe.

 

Hi,

 

Good news indeed. I've flown with Bangkok Airways on the BKK/Phuket route and I was happy with the website/Airbus/ and service. Will be good for competition as Thai seem to have lost the plot.

[Indiscipline 6]

eltib,

 

The good news as far as the Brits/Euros are concerned is that Bangkok Airways has ordered/agreed to buy the A350XWB to set up its long haul routes to Europe. A few years down the line and a lot can change but a nice option from Thai/EVA to look forward to.

 

Even better, Bangkok Airways will lease some A330`s to fill the gap till the A350`s deliveries.

The will most likley start routing LHR-BKK, FRA-BKK and CDG-BKK winter 2009!

Good for me here in Germany, because the old "price breaker" Royal Brunei stoped the FRA-BKK flights last September.

[CheshireTom 1,377]

First Fully Assembled Boeing 787 Dreamliner Rolls Out

Brandon Hill (Blog) - June 28, 2007 3:12 PM

 

It has been a long time coming, but the first Boeing 787 Dreamliner has rolled off the assembly line. Charles Conklin -- an avid aviation enthusiast -- managed to snap some pictures of a fully assembled Dreamliner sans paint..............................

 

 

.........................How sweet it is. Once again American ingenuity and manufacturing prowess comes to the fore. Along with the many suppliers all over the globe the Dreamliner rolls out ahead of schedule with the engines attached.

 

Well, it looks like BigD has put his foot in it again ......................

 

 

"American ingenuity and manufacturing prowess comes to the fore .................... the Dreamliner rolls out ahead of schedule with the engines attached."

 

Unfortunately, 6 months later this is what they have got ............ no engines, no avionics and no delivery date .....

[eltib 54]

Well, it looks like BigD has put his foot in it again ......................

"American ingenuity and manufacturing prowess comes to the fore .................... the Dreamliner rolls out ahead of schedule with the engines attached."

 

Unfortunately, 6 months later this is what they have got ............ no engines, no avionics and no delivery date .....

 

Looks like they'll have to rename the Dreamliner a "hangar queen."

 

[nidnoyham 30]

Didn't Howard Hughes have a similar project ?

[CheshireTom 1,377]

Didn't Howard Hughes have a similar project ?

 

And Icarus ...........

[Indiscipline 6]

Rumours, rumours!!!

 

I got the following story from 2 different sources ( Airbus and a key Aerospace supplier ):

Both told me independently, that the 787 fuselage did bust during a pressure stress test.

If that is true, the delays will be much bigger than expected. This would come on top of the fact, that the

parts that are manufactured by the different program supplier simply don`t fit to each other.

Would be yet another fine example of the superior engineering, management and whatever skills of the US.

But I`m sure, our super war hero, investment guru, flying cambridge educated postman will come to save them.

[eltib 54]

Rumours, rumours!!!

 

I got the following story from 2 different sources ( Airbus and a key Aerospace supplier ):

Both told me independently, that the 787 fuselage did bust during a pressure stress test.

If that is true, the delays will be much bigger than expected. This would come on top of the fact, that the

parts that are manufactured by the different program supplier simply don`t fit to each other.

Would be yet another fine example of the superior engineering, management and whatever skills of the US.

But I`m sure, our super war hero, investment guru, flying cambridge educated postman will come to save them.

 

Yeah, and Scally assured me that the plane wouldn't fail under pressure. Thanx for the info. Doesn't look like the hanger queen will be getting off the ground anytime soon.

[wacmedia 277]

Yeah, and Scally assured me that the plane wouldn't fail under pressure. Thanx for the info. Doesn't look like the hanger queen will be getting off the ground anytime soon.

 

Hi,

 

I call it the Nightmareliner and you call it the Hanger Queen. Wonder what the guys at Boeing call it at the moment ?

[TheFiend 1,181]

Rumours, rumours!!!

 

I got the following story from 2 different sources ( Airbus and a key Aerospace supplier ):

Both told me independently, that the 787 fuselage did bust during a pressure stress test.

If that is true, the delays will be much bigger than expected. This would come on top of the fact, that the

parts that are manufactured by the different program supplier simply don`t fit to each other.

Would be yet another fine example of the superior engineering, management and whatever skills of the US.

But I`m sure, our super war hero, investment guru, flying cambridge educated postman will come to save them.

 

Oh dear......... if that is the case the delays might be much, much longer.

 

 

Wonder what the guys at Boeing call it at the moment ?

 

Maybe a useless heap of junk!!!

[eltib 54]

Hi,

 

I call it the Nightmareliner and you call it the Hanger Queen. Wonder what the guys at Boeing call it at the moment ?

 

The next bumper for your car

Edited January 28, 2008 by eltib

[TheFiend 1,181]

Have you noticed how quiet the 3 stooges have gone on this subject????

[BigDUSA 71]

CHICAGO - Boeing Co. said Wednesday its fourth-quarter profit rose 4 percent on higher commercial airplane deliveries and strong growth in defense earnings, beating Wall Street's expectations despite ongoing concerns over delays in its 787 Dreamliner program.

 

The world's second-largest commercial airplane maker said it continues to address problems in assembling the first 787s and slightly reduced its estimate for both 2008 revenue and deliveries because of the previously announced glitches. It said it remains on the revised schedule announced earlier this month.

 

Boeing shares, which have fallen this year over 787-related concerns, rose 21 cents to $81.17 in morning trading after trading as low as $79.69 earlier in the session.

 

Net income for the last three months of 2007 was $1.03 billion, or $1.36 per share, up from $989 million, or $1.29 per share, in the fourth quarter of 2006. That was 4 cents per share better than the consensus estimate of analysts polled by Thomson Financial.

 

Revenue was $17.5 billion, flat with a year earlier but slightly above analysts' forecast of $17.3 billion.

 

The company increased its guidance for 2008 earnings per share to between $5.70 and $5.85 from an earlier range of $5.55 to $5.75, still short of the Wall Street consensus estimate of $5.95. It also lowered its estimate of 2008 revenue by $500 million, to a range of $67 billion to $68 billion, due to the 787 delay.

 

Boeing's continued resurgence in the quarter was led by its Seattle-based commercial airplane manufacturing business, where operating earnings increased 46 percent to $973 million and revenue jumped 17 percent to $8.9 billion. Deliveries rose 9 percent to 112 and the record backlog grew 46 percent to $255 billion, reflecting strong demand for the 787 and other planes.

 

The Chicago-based company closed the gap on Airbus in aircraft deliveries but still ended the year trailing its European rival for a fifth straight year, 453 to 441, while outpacing it in orders. It scaled back its estimate of 2008 deliveries to between 475 and 480, down from 480 to 490, to reflect the rescheduling of initial 787 deliveries into 2009.

 

The unit's continued success depends on how quickly Boeing can untangle snags in the 787 program. Boeing said Jan. 16 it would push back the 787's inaugural flight until the end of the second quarter due to supply chain problems and slow progress on the assembly line, with the first delivery not expected until early 2009.

 

Chief Executive Jim McNerney alluded to the unresolved 787 issues but did not elaborate in the company's earnings statement. "Despite some development program challenges, we are a strong company growing stronger and we expect continued improvement in our financial results in 2008 and beyond," he said.

 

The company's St. Louis-based military contracting business saw earnings from operations decline 5 percent to $978 million and revenue fall 14 percent to $8.6 billion. The revenue drop was largely because results from a year earlier included two months of revenue from its Delta IV family of rockets, which are now part of United Launch Alliance, a joint venture with Lockheed Martin Corp.

 

Boeing had full-year earnings of $4.1 billion, or $5.28 per share, up 84 percent from $2.2 billion, or $2.85 per share, in 2006. Revenue climbed 8 percent to $66.4 billion from $61.5 billion.

 

 

Once again how sweet it is to see Boeing doing well.

[CheshireTom 1,377]

The Chicago-based company closed the gap on Airbus in aircraft deliveries but still ended the year trailing its European rival for a fifth straight year, 453 to 441,

 

'nuff said ................

[nidnoyham 30]

I would like to patent hemp based material for aircraft parts. It' strong, light, cheap to produce and the plane gets higher quicker.

[CheshireTom 1,377]

I would like to patent hemp based material for aircraft parts. It' strong, light, cheap to produce and the plane gets higher quicker.

 

 

Now, admit it .............. you'll be out to have a look, won't you

 

 

SIA to fly A380 to London from 18 March

By Nicholas Ionides

 

Singapore Airlines (SIA) has set 18 March as the date for the introduction of Airbus A380 services on the Singapore-London Heathrow route.

The Star Alliance carrier currently only operates the aircraft between Singapore and Sydney but says it will be able to offer daily services between Singapore and London Heathrow once its third A380 is delivered.

SIA recently took delivery of its second A380 and says its third is due to be delivered by Airbus by the middle of March.

[BigDUSA 71]

Now, admit it .............. you'll be out to have a look, won't you

SIA to fly A380 to London from 18 March

By Nicholas Ionides

 

Singapore Airlines (SIA) has set 18 March as the date for the introduction of Airbus A380 services on the Singapore-London Heathrow route.

The Star Alliance carrier currently only operates the aircraft between Singapore and Sydney but says it will be able to offer daily services between Singapore and London Heathrow once its third A380 is delivered.

SIA recently took delivery of its second A380 and says its third is due to be delivered by Airbus by the middle of March.

 

I'm glad to see SQ add service with the 380. I'm waiting for then to start service between JFK-SIN. I'd give them a go to see what the 380 is like.