Airbus and Boeing products running behind schedule

[wacmedia 277]

Hi,

 

Happy days for Airbus.

 

http://gulfnews.com/business/aviation/chin...liners-1.738731

 

China Eastern orders 50 Airbus A320 airliners

 

Investment to cost firm $3.22b with planes to be delivered in stages

 

AFP Published: 00:00 December 31, 2010

Hong Kong: China Eastern Airlines said yesterday it had agreed with Europe-based Airbus to buy 50 A320 airliners with a list price of $3.22 billion (Dh11.8 billion), in the latest sign of the country's aviation boom.

 

China Eastern said in an announcement to the Hong Kong Stock Exchange the aircraft would be delivered in stages from 2012 to 2015 and would expand its capacity by 11.24 per cent including the fleet of its Shanghai Airlines subsidiary.

 

The airline did not disclose the price of its acquisition but said the Airbus consortium had granted it "significant price concessions... which will mainly affect the depreciation of the aircraft in the operation cost of the company."

 

The announcement marks the latest in a line of large deals by some of the bigger players in China's burgeoning aviation market.

 

More purchases

 

Last week Shandong Airlines said it planned to buy 15 Boeing passenger planes worth up to $1.2 billion, to be delivered between 2014 and 2015.

 

In November, Air China said it had agreed to buy 20 passenger planes from Airbus in a deal worth $4.49 billion. Half the planes would be A330s and the other half were to be A350 series aircraft, the company said. Also in November, China Southern Airlines said it had agreed to buy 36 planes from Airbus for $3.78 billion.

 

In September, Hong Kong-based carrier Cath-ay Pacific said it had confirmed an order for 30 long-range A350 Airbus aircraft with a book price of $7.82 billion — the biggest single order in the carrier's history.

 

China's rapidly expanding economy has seen the country's aviation sector grow at a blistering pace over the past few years, with few analysts seeing any likelihood of a slow down.

[Yzi 72]

Hi,

 

Happy days for Airbus.

 

http://gulfnews.com/business/aviation/chin...liners-1.738731

 

China Eastern orders 50 Airbus A320 airliners

 

Investment to cost firm $3.22b with planes to be delivered in stages

 

AFP Published: 00:00 December 31, 2010

 

136 total for airbus, 15 for boeing

[Fireman Sam 336]

When the highly experienced Qantas pilot experiences the same type of catastrophic engine failure on a Boeing airplane. Get back to me. Until then his opinion has little relevance.

 

 

Absolute classic !!!!

 

 

Regards

Fireman Sam

[Samsonite 181]

The 2 777's with the engine failures are only 2 and 4 years old and were bought new, so have hardly suffered years of neglect.

You didn't read the thread, obviously.

[Samsonite 181]

136 total for airbus, 15 for boeing

Is that just for the one airline?

[TheFiend 1,181]

You didn't read the thread, obviously.

 

Didn't I? I find it funny that a team of techs from GE had just been working on the engines of D2-TEE at Lisbon prior to the flight and had obviously given it the all clear to fly.

 

Yes, TAAG have had a chequered history and been subject to a European ban previously, but they must have done enough to gain clearance to resume operations into Europe again. Their older aircraft are still subject to a ban.

 

So I haven't read the thread?

[TheFiend 1,181]

What is interesting with airline orders this year is that Airbus has done much better than Boeing in the twin aisle market with the A330/A350/A380 compared to the 747/777/767/787. There is only the 737NG that has been selling well for Boeing.

[Samsonite 181]

Didn't I? I find it funny that a team of techs from GE had just been working on the engines....

 

So I haven't read the thread?...

Not very well. It is only a rumor that there was anyone there from GE.

 

"Quoting Aesma (Reply 5):

I guess one week of maintenance can't undo the damage done during months/years of poor oversight.

****************

I read today that they're now trying to blame Boeing for it. LOL. Hundreds of 777's with GE engines are operating in the world and all 3 of theirs have a problem. Gee, I wonder where the real problem is.

********

Quoting MHTripple7 (Reply 7):

Right, but an engine failure still shouldn't happen literally a day after the aircraft gets out of heavy maintenance in Portugal. Shouldn't they have seen the problems in Portugal before letting the aircraft fly again?

*************

Quoting MHTripple7 (Reply 14):

Again, I don't have an official source but from what I've heard a team from GE was in LIS doing some work on the engines of both D2-TEF and D2-TEE.

********

I'm not sure where you got that from. The 777 from the accident at LIS is still parked at LIS, without an engine, and it's not going anywhere any time soon. There is no GE90 maintenance at LIS. TAP maintenance is not certified on the GE90."

 

 

The only person trying to defend TAAG is an Angolan citizen and here is a respond to some of his statements:

 

"UAL747DEN From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1931 posts, RR: 16

Reply 37, posted Mon Dec 27 2010 20:10:33 your local time (3 days 23 hours 25 minutes ago) and read 3208 times:

 

Quoting Speedbird741 (Reply 30):

 

Quite frankly, 2 (serious) engine failures within one month in a fleet of 3 state of the art, well maintained and appropriately operated aircraft is reason enough for me to believe something out of TAAG's control is happening.

 

Response:

I would think that this would lead you to believe that the only reasonable explanation is that TAAG is doing something wrong and that the problem is completely within their control. With over 900 Boeing 777's flying everyday without major problems how can an airline who only has 3 of them experience these problems without being the cause of the problem?

When you look at the fact that TAAG's maintenance and operational standards have been seriously lacking behind worldwide standards I think it should be more than obvious that the problem with these aircraft is TAAG not Boeing or GE.

 

Quoting Speedbird741 (Reply 30):

This is ridiculous. TAAG is a good airline with appropriately trained flight crews that follow the operational procedures recomended by Boeing and set by leading international carriers.

 

Response:

The only ridiculous thing here is your statement, TAAG is nowhere near the leading international carriers when it comes to operational procedures, maintenance, or anything else that goes into running an airline. TAAG was just recently taken off of the EU blacklist and must prove itself worthy to stay off of that blacklist constantly. With the upcoming audit from EU authorities I have a strong feeling that they will find themselves banned again from Europe.

 

When you compare the practices and procedures of TAAG to an airline like United I find it extremely offensive. We work very hard to have a safe efficient operation and we are so far beyond TAAG on all levels that its upsetting to hear someone say that their crews are trained to the same level as ours. (see below!)

 

Quoting Speedbird741 (Reply 30):

Furthermore, even if crews were using more thrust than is required for takeoff and climb (which they are not), GE have committed some quite serious mistakes as they have built an engine that either explodes or fails after no more than two years of operation within the limits of maximum continuous thrust.

 

Response:

Again another ridiculous statement! The problem here is not GE the problem is TAAG. GE has thousands of engines flying around on 777's all over the world without problems, TAAG has a total of 3 aircraft and cannot even keep those airworthy. There is a reason TAAG is blacklisted and it has nothing to do with GE or Boeing.

 

Quoting cahmc85 (Reply 23):

It might have nothing to do with this but let's not forget that these aircraft were grounded in Seattle waiting delivery because the pilots were having difficulties in learning to fly the aircraft.

 

Response:

Hmmmm I guess thats Boeing's fault for not being up to the high international standards of TAAG, right speedbird?!?!?"

Edited January 1, 2011 by Samsonite

[Samsonite 181]

What is interesting with airline orders this year is that Airbus has done much better than Boeing in the twin aisle market with the A330/A350/A380 compared to the 747/777/767/787. There is only the 737NG that has been selling well for Boeing.

Interesting that the A320 family (comparable to the Boeing 737) it the only line that usually sells well for Airbust, so it is good to see they also sell a few twin aisle aircraft every now and then.

The a330 is selling well for airbust, but many were sold not only due to the delays in the Boeing 787 program, but because the 787 production line is sold out for the next few years and they can get a a330 in a year or so. Emirates placed another large order for the a380 and now controls about 40% of the a380 order book. The a340 is dead for all practical purposes. They have sold some 350s.

Plus the are three other companies trying to break into the A320/B737 market and I hope they do well as the Airbus/Boeing duopoly could use some serious competition.

It will be interesting to see how it all washes out over the next five years to ten years or so.

Edited January 1, 2011 by Samsonite

[TheFiend 1,181]

Interesting that the A320 family (comparable to the Boeing 737) it the only line that usually sells well for Airbust, so it is good to see they call also a few twin aisle aircraft every now and then.

The a330 is selling well for airbust, but many were sold not only due to the delays in the Boeing 787 program, but because the 787 production line is sold out for the next few years and they can get a a330 in a year or so. Emirates placed another large order for the a380 and now controls about 40% of the a380 order book. The a340 is dead for all practical purposes. They have sold some 350s.

 

The A350 managed to gain more orders than the A330, so your reasoning doesn't quite ring true. Over the last 2 years Airbus has managed a net gain of orders for the A350 whereas the 7LATE7 has suffered a net loss.

[TheFiend 1,181]

A lot of the posts on that thread are only speculation. Until the official report comes out then nobody really know what has gone on with those 777's.

 

Not very well. It is only a rumor that there was anyone there from GE.

 

"Quoting Aesma (Reply 5):

I guess one week of maintenance can't undo the damage done during months/years of poor oversight.

****************

I read today that they're now trying to blame Boeing for it. LOL. Hundreds of 777's with GE engines are operating in the world and all 3 of theirs have a problem. Gee, I wonder where the real problem is.

********

Quoting MHTripple7 (Reply 7):

Right, but an engine failure still shouldn't happen literally a day after the aircraft gets out of heavy maintenance in Portugal. Shouldn't they have seen the problems in Portugal before letting the aircraft fly again?

*************

Quoting MHTripple7 (Reply 14):

Again, I don't have an official source but from what I've heard a team from GE was in LIS doing some work on the engines of both D2-TEF and D2-TEE.

********

I'm not sure where you got that from. The 777 from the accident at LIS is still parked at LIS, without an engine, and it's not going anywhere any time soon. There is no GE90 maintenance at LIS. TAP maintenance is not certified on the GE90."

 

 

The only person trying to defend TAAG is an Angolan citizen and here is a respond to some of his statements:

 

"UAL747DEN From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1931 posts, RR: 16

Reply 37, posted Mon Dec 27 2010 20:10:33 your local time (3 days 23 hours 25 minutes ago) and read 3208 times:

 

Quoting Speedbird741 (Reply 30):

 

Quite frankly, 2 (serious) engine failures within one month in a fleet of 3 state of the art, well maintained and appropriately operated aircraft is reason enough for me to believe something out of TAAG's control is happening.

 

Response:

I would think that this would lead you to believe that the only reasonable explanation is that TAAG is doing something wrong and that the problem is completely within their control. With over 900 Boeing 777's flying everyday without major problems how can an airline who only has 3 of them experience these problems without being the cause of the problem?

When you look at the fact that TAAG's maintenance and operational standards have been seriously lacking behind worldwide standards I think it should be more than obvious that the problem with these aircraft is TAAG not Boeing or GE.

 

Quoting Speedbird741 (Reply 30):

This is ridiculous. TAAG is a good airline with appropriately trained flight crews that follow the operational procedures recomended by Boeing and set by leading international carriers.

 

Response:

The only ridiculous thing here is your statement, TAAG is nowhere near the leading international carriers when it comes to operational procedures, maintenance, or anything else that goes into running an airline. TAAG was just recently taken off of the EU blacklist and must prove itself worthy to stay off of that blacklist constantly. With the upcoming audit from EU authorities I have a strong feeling that they will find themselves banned again from Europe.

 

When you compare the practices and procedures of TAAG to an airline like United I find it extremely offensive. We work very hard to have a safe efficient operation and we are so far beyond TAAG on all levels that its upsetting to hear someone say that their crews are trained to the same level as ours. (see below!)

 

Quoting Speedbird741 (Reply 30):

Furthermore, even if crews were using more thrust than is required for takeoff and climb (which they are not), GE have committed some quite serious mistakes as they have built an engine that either explodes or fails after no more than two years of operation within the limits of maximum continuous thrust.

 

Response:

Again another ridiculous statement! The problem here is not GE the problem is TAAG. GE has thousands of engines flying around on 777's all over the world without problems, TAAG has a total of 3 aircraft and cannot even keep those airworthy. There is a reason TAAG is blacklisted and it has nothing to do with GE or Boeing.

 

Quoting cahmc85 (Reply 23):

It might have nothing to do with this but let's not forget that these aircraft were grounded in Seattle waiting delivery because the pilots were having difficulties in learning to fly the aircraft.

 

Response:

Hmmmm I guess thats Boeing's fault for not being up to the high international standards of TAAG, right speedbird?!?!?"

[wacmedia 277]

The Boeing 787 Dreamliner is expected to make its first flight in August of 2007 with delivery starting in 2008. .

 

Hi,

 

I think it's 2011 now.

[TheFiend 1,181]

Hi,

 

I think it's 2011 now.

 

It is 2011!!!!

[TheFiend 1,181]

Wikileaks reveals dodgy dealings by the US....

 

No surprises there then!!!

 

Remember when Boeing got caught with cheating with the Tanker contract!!!

[joekicker 53]

Wikileaks reveals dodgy dealings by the US....[/url]

 

But that's not what it says.

 

No surprises there then!!! whistling

 

I hope not. It is one of the reasonably important jobs of ANY embassy of EVERY country to push its national companies and their products. It is what a "trade attache" does, even American ones. That's why even the EU, for example, has a trade office in Bangkok - PLUS every country in the EU has a trade attache in Bangkok. I'm sort of surprised that this is "news" - slow New Year holiday, I'd guess.

 

.

Edited January 3, 2011 by joekicker

[BigDUSA 71]

The Herald

Send a letter to the editorThe Boeing Co.'s fourth flight test 787 is back in the air today.

 

This is only the second time since Boeing's Dec. 23 announcement that the 787 would resume flight test activities that the Dreamliner has been in the air.

 

According to FlightAware, the fourth 787 test plane took off from Boeing Field at a little before noon today, heading for Moses Lake, Wash.

 

An electrical fire in November grounded Boeing's 787 flight test fleet and put up in the air the Dreamliner's delivery schedule.

 

Boeing is expected to give an update on the 787's delivery schedule this month.

QUOTE

[Samsonite 181]

The Herald

Send a letter to the editorThe Boeing Co.'s fourth flight test 787 is back in the air today.

 

This is only the second time since Boeing's Dec. 23 announcement that the 787 would resume flight test activities that the Dreamliner has been in the air.

 

According to FlightAware, the fourth 787 test plane took off from Boeing Field at a little before noon today, heading for Moses Lake, Wash.

 

An electrical fire in November grounded Boeing's 787 flight test fleet and put up in the air the Dreamliner's delivery schedule.

 

Boeing is expected to give an update on the 787's delivery schedule this month.

QUOTE

The plane that had the fire flew again on 23 December and made 3 flights on Monday, 3 January.

Boeing traditionally closes for the Christmas Holiday from the end of business on 23 December until the first business day of the new year.

Edited January 4, 2011 by Samsonite

[wacmedia 277]

Wikileaks reveals dodgy dealings by the US....

 

Hi,

 

Thats not news. News would be if the US was found to have dealt in an ethical manner.

[BigusDicus 9,875]

The Making of Florida 1

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=zKnsy...feature=popular

 

Video is of the assembly of a 737 airplane and the custom painting of same for their biggest customer, Southwest Airlines, whose entire fleet consists of 737 aircraft made by Boeing. If you ever visit the northwest, try to schedule a visit to the Boeing Wide Body Assembly plant in Everett, WA where they can build up to 48 wide body aircraft simultaneously under one roof (747’s, 777’s, and 787’s). Enjoy this video. They take you on a plant tour, and around the facility where they paint the wide bodied birds after you see a video in their Visitors Center.

[TheFiend 1,181]

Airbus gets another A380 order......

 

Read this!!!

 

Yes, it's only an order for 6 but they are a new customer for the A380, although they haven't chosen the engine supplier yet.....

 

Nice start to the year for Airbus!!!!

[BigDUSA 71]

CHICAGO (Reuters) – Boeing Co (BA.N) delivered 116 commercial airplanes in the fourth quarter, down from 122 a year earlier, the company said on Thursday.

 

The world's second-largest commercial planemaker after Airbus (EAD.PA) said 95 of those deliveries were of its 737 Next Generation, compared with 92 a year earlier.

 

The company delivered 18 widebody 777s in the fourth quarter, down from 25 a year earlier.

 

The deliveries bring the 2010 total to 462 planes for Boeing Commercial Airplanes, compared with 481 in 2009. Boeing gets paid for its planes at delivery.

 

The company said it had booked 530 net orders in 2010 as the global economy recovered from a downturn in recent years. Boeing reported only 142 net orders in 2009 as airline customers struggled.

 

The company said its order backlog for its 737, 777, 747, 767 and 787 models amounted to 3,443 planes at the end of 2010.

 

Boeing said it would provide a forecast of 2011 commercial airplane deliveries when it releases year-end earnings January 26.

 

Shares of Boeing, a component of the Dow Jones industrial average (.DJI), were up 0.6 percent at $67.88 on Nasdaq.

 

(Reporting by Kyle Peterson; Editing by Derek Caney and Lisa Von Ahn)

QUOTE

[TheFiend 1,181]

The company said it had booked 530 net orders in 2010 as the global economy recovered from a downturn in recent years. Boeing reported only 142 net orders in 2009 as airline customers struggled.

 

Net sales by Model:-

737 = 486

747 = -1

767 = 3

777 = 46

787 = -4

 

Take out the 737 orders and the results don't look very good at all. A net total of 44 wide-body orders, which is less than the net orders Airbus received for just the A330...

 

Boeing might be winning in the narrow body market, but currently Airbus have lead in the wide body market.

[TheFiend 1,181]

Another lost order for Boeing

 

Guggenheim Aviation Partners, a leasing firm based in Issaquah, canceled its remaining order for two Boeing 747-8 Freighters because of continued delays with the program, Bloomberg reported Thursday.

 

Guggenheim originally ordered four 747-8s, with options for two more, in 2006. But it halved the order in December 2009.

 

Oh dear.......

 

This cancellation is included in the 2010 figures but has only just been reported.

[Samsonite 181]

Another lost order for Boeing

 

This cancellation is included in the 2010 figures but has only just been reported.

Those were to be leased to Korean Air Cargo which has already bought 5 directly from Boeing.

Most likely Korean Air will just up their order to 7. Those two 747-8Fs have already been

assembled, painted in the Korean Air Cargo livery and are sitting on the flight line.

 

Why didn't you post the gross sales to show how many were actually sold during the year.

 

737 = 508

747 = 1

767 = 3

777 = 76

787 = 37

Total Gross orders = 625

 

The cancellations of 777s was the result of the troubles at JAL and that Dubai leasing company (sorry, can't remember the name).

Edited January 7, 2011 by Samsonite

[TheFiend 1,181]

Why didn't you post the gross sales to show how many were actually sold during the year.

 

737 = 508

747 = 1

767 = 3

777 = 76

787 = 37

Total Gross orders = 625

 

Because gross orders isn't the real figure...

 

Yes 76 777's were ordered, but 30 were cancelled.....

Yes 37 7LATE7's were ordered, but 41 were cancelled....