Changes to security departing BKK

[Emil 0]

What is more efficient, a single central security for all the airport or 25+ little independent ones at each gate.....?

Toughie this one...........

 

 

Are you winding me up?

 

Not winding you up. For security for the aircraft I would say having the security at each gate as there is less of a chance of something getting thru and being hidden in let say a restroom for another person to retrieve. Like I mentioned earlier you wouldn't have to do security for all of the employees and supplies who work at the retail shop, restaurants and vendors that provide the supplies. These independent ones have exactly the same security devices as the larger ones. Even the large airports like BKK dosen't have a single central security area as I've been thru 2 areas myself for just the gates that I use. (I think its the D gates) If its security for the terminal itself then the best spot would be prior to entering the terminal itself.

 

I agree that the airport would have to purchase more of these security devices and hire more staff. I like this airport and think they provide more for the traveler than any airport that I've been thru. They have computer stations throughout the terminal that are free, all they ask is thatyou don't hog the station if someone is waiting. I also saw a small theater showing movies for free while one waits for their flight.

Edited October 15, 2009 by Emil

[jacko 8,813]

Not winding you up. For security for the aircraft I would say having the security at each gate as there is less of a chance of something getting thru and being hidden in let say a restroom for another person to retrieve. Like I mentioned earlier you wouldn't have to do security for all of the employees and supplies who work at the retail shop, restaurants and vendors that provide the supplies. These independent ones have exactly the same security devices as the larger ones. Even the large airports like BKK dosen't have a single central security area as I've been thru 2 areas myself for just the gates that I use. (I think its the D gates) If its security for the terminal itself then the best spot would be prior to entering the terminal itself.

 

I agree that the airport would have to purchase more of these security devices and hire more staff. I like this airport and think they provide more for the traveler than any airport that I've been thru. They have computer stations throughout the terminal that are free, all they ask is thatyou don't hog the station if someone is waiting. I also saw a small theater showing movies for free while one waits for their flight.

Well it would seem that airports do not agree as, for example, Bangkok has centralised to a single main security just after immigration. I have always found it most annoying to be called out of the lounge on a 'boarding call' to be subjected to further security at the gate, long lines, and then packed into a gate holding area at the top of the jetway, which is not yet open.

 

Do security once and do it well.

 

Your consideration of the airport retailing staff (I don't see why they should not go through a security check of their own) is minor. Your way we now have to put all the passenger purchases through security checks at the gate, particularly the liquids.

How about the staff who do the checks at the aircraft, where did they go through security?

Also the boarding staff, caterers, luggage security, pilot and stewardesses.

Are you planning that they drag all the X-ray equipment between gates or, rather inefficiently, have a set at every single gate and the multiple skilled operators. No, this is dumb..... as security checks become more sophisticated, the equipment changes, it s looks for other than metal (liquids and plastic weapons), fast moving but fewer devices is more practical. Moving it to the gates where space is limited, and repeating it x number of operating gates..... ???

 

Then again, there might be a new trend of suicide bombers at the crowds going through security at the gate! Yes let us give them an opportunity to sneak a tank in pieces and assemble it in the toilet or Power Duty Free.

Edited October 15, 2009 by jacko

[Myrrh 0]

I have noticed more changes in security when arriving at BKK than when leaving.

 

Now ALL bags need to go through a scanner before you can leave the airport after collecting them and there was a sign saying that various things e.g. medical equipment or currency in excess of 20000 USD would be confiscated.

[ozijeff 9]

eeek, i might get in trouble for bringing in 2 bottles of wine!

[Emil 0]

Well it would seem that airports do not agree as, for example, Bangkok has centralised to a single main security just after immigration. I have always found it most annoying to be called out of the lounge on a 'boarding call' to be subjected to further security at the gate, long lines, and then packed into a gate holding area at the top of the jetway, which is not yet open.

 

You need to take a closer look at BKK as they don't have a single security check point. I told you before that just the gate area that I use has 2 security check points. By chance I noticed another security check area for another group of gate due to the fact that I now have to use a different Thai Airline lounge. So I'm guessing that they have a security checks at each group of gate areas. BKK does not have security just after immigration, the air lounges retail shops and restaurants are all located before you have to go thru security.

 

I've only gone thru the Singapore Airport twice, as I fly United and only get the opportunity to fly on Singapore when I get lucky when I use my air miles. Both times there was no waiting time when I went thru the security at the gate area, unlike the long lines that I've had to wait at LAX, SFO and Narita.

 

Do you really think that the airports that have the single security check point are doing so because if provides better security and not that they would have to purchase more security devices, hire more staff and pay to re-configure each gate area?

Edited October 17, 2009 by Emil

[jacko 8,813]

You need to take a closer look at BKK as they don't have a single security check point. I told you before that just the gate area that I use has 2 security check points. By chance I noticed another security check area for another group of gate due to the fact that I now have to use a different Thai Airline lounge. So I'm guessing that they have a security checks at each group of gate areas. BKK does not have security just after immigration, the air lounges retail shops and restaurants are all located before you have to go thru security.

 

I've only gone thru the Singapore Airport twice, as I fly United and only get the opportunity to fly on Singapore when I get lucky when I use my air miles. Both times there was no waiting time when I went thru the security at the gate area, unlike the long lines that I've had to wait at LAX, SFO and Narita.

 

Do you really think that the airports that have the single security check point are doing so because if provides better security and not that they would have to purchase more security devices, hire more staff and pay to re-configure each gate area?

Actually, at Bangkok I went through security before immigration. I posted it was a bit of a nuisance trying to get my belt back in and passport out at the same time. Others (Eneukman) have posted completely contradicting your statement above, so someone is wrong. I am getting tired of this..... I just repeat the statements.

Non passengers should not be allowed to go to the gates.

A centralised security doing a thorough job is far more efficient than 25 or more security checks at the gates.

American carriers, or carriers to America, may well have a secondary security check at the gate area.

My last flight via Qatar in September, I did not go through any further security checks after the one PRIOR to immigration.

And very efficient that was too.

Things may be different now as it is some weeks later...... so I will have to take my closer look at Bangkok next time I fly, which may well not be until Spring.

I have flown through Singapore Airport more than twice, and used Singapore Airlines many times. You apparently are stuck on United. One carrier from one country.

 

I think that airports have single security checks for all passengers because it makes a lot more sense than having multiple ones at each gate with the multiple repetition of equipment and personnel. You have to check passports and boarding cards centrally anyhow. Bangkok used to have security prior to check in and at the entrance to each gate wing. Apparently that has been changed, I noticed it, Eneukman did, 2 slices short and Stinky too. Stinky thought it vastly improved. You prefer security checks at each gate with crowds of relatives waving off the passengers there. As you like. I think we can conclude some carriers will still do gate security checks as a vote of no-confidence (thanks Joe), but passengers will still go through a prior check irrespective of you thinking individual gate checks being better.

I seem to recall that many US airports have security centralised, well after 9-11. Prior to that it was low level... allowing non-passengers through too.

[Emil 0]

Actually, at Bangkok I went through security before immigration. I posted it was a bit of a nuisance trying to get my belt back in and passport out at the same time. Others (Eneukman) have posted completely contradicting your statement above, so someone is wrong. I am getting tired of this..... I just repeat the statements.

Non passengers should not be allowed to go to the gates.

A centralised security doing a thorough job is far more efficient than 25 or more security checks at the gates.

American carriers, or carriers to America, may well have a secondary security check at the gate area.

My last flight via Qatar in September, I did not go through any further security checks after the one PRIOR to immigration.

And very efficient that was too.

Things may be different now as it is some weeks later...... so I will have to take my closer look at Bangkok next time I fly, which may well not be until Spring.

I have flown through Singapore Airport more than twice, and used Singapore Airlines many times. You apparently are stuck on United. One carrier from one country.

 

I think that airports have single security checks for all passengers because it makes a lot more sense than having multiple ones at each gate with the multiple repetition of equipment and personnel. You have to check passports and boarding cards centrally anyhow. Bangkok used to have security prior to check in and at the entrance to each gate wing. Apparently that has been changed, I noticed it, Eneukman did, 2 slices short and Stinky too. Stinky thought it vastly improved. You prefer security checks at each gate with crowds of relatives waving off the passengers there. As you like. I think we can conclude some carriers will still do gate security checks as a vote of no-confidence (thanks Joe), but passengers will still go through a prior check irrespective of you thinking individual gate checks being better.

I seem to recall that many US airports have security centralised, well after 9-11. Prior to that it was low level... allowing non-passengers through too.

 

I last went through BKK on Aug 19th which was my 17th time since the new airport opened so it sounds like things have changed from what I've been telling you, I will find out in a few days as I depart on the 21st and will post my experiences on this topic.

Edited October 18, 2009 by Emil

[jacko 8,813]

I last went through BKK on Aug 19th which was my 17th time since the new airport opened so it sounds like things have changed from what I've been telling you, I will find out in a few days as I depart on the 21st and will post my experiences on this topic.

I can't even remember when the new airport opened, nor have I counted how many times I have been through it. Edited October 18, 2009 by jacko

[Emil 0]

I can't even remember when the new airport opened, nor have I counted how many times I have been through it.

 

 

Sep 2006, the reason I remember it was about the same time of Thaskin's departure and when I first got my retirement visa as I decided to wait an additional day to see how the situation was in Bangkok before I headed to the US Embassy for my income verification form. I make 6 trips a year to LOS so its easy to do the math.

[jacko 8,813]

Sep 2006, the reason I remember it was about the same time of Thaskin's departure and when I first got my retirement visa as I decided to wait an additional day to see how the situation was in Bangkok before I headed to the US Embassy for my income verification form. I make 6 trips a year to LOS so its easy to do the math.

I normally only do 2 UK trips out per year, but sometimes do a 3 month visa run to somewhere nearby, like Singapore or Bali.

[joekicker 53]

You need to take a closer look at BKK as they don't have a single security check point. I told you before that just the gate area that I use has 2 security check points.

 

No, you do Emil. Bangkok airport has one security checkpoint. IN ADDITION, several of the airlines operate their own security setup. If you use United at Gate 2 for example, there is a United security check at that gate after the airport check and before you are allowed into the boarding area. The airport has nothing to do with that (second) security. United (and some other airlines) ALSO have security at check-in -- bags are x-rayed BY UNITED and some passengers are singled out for full baggage checks before they are allowed past check-in and into immigration. So if you fly United out of Suvarnabhumi, you face a possible four security checks, "possible" because you may actually be unaware of the first two.

 

- all bags (suitcases, non-carry-on) through x-ray before check-in, by United Airlines,

- both bags and body during check-in, but only on a spot basis, by United

- official airport security after immigration by the security firm hired by AoT, and

- a final United security check at the actual departure gate, focussed on the carry-on bags.

 

I'm only using United as the example because you did. Other airlines do much the same. Many/most airlines do none of the above, and trust the Airports of Thailand contractor to handle security at the single post-immigration, pre-departure-gate location.

 

The actual airport security, provided by the Loxley-ICTS consortium, a private joint-venture firm, is centralised.

 

.

Edited October 19, 2009 by joekicker

[Emil 0]

No, you do Emil. Bangkok airport has one security checkpoint. IN ADDITION, several of the airlines operate their own security setup. If you use United at Gate 2 for example, there is a United security check at that gate after the airport check and before you are allowed into the boarding area. The airport has nothing to do with that (second) security. United (and some other airlines) ALSO have security at check-in -- bags are x-rayed BY UNITED and some passengers are singled out for full baggage checks before they are allowed past check-in and into immigration. So if you fly United out of Suvarnabhumi, you face a possible four security checks, "possible" because you may actually be unaware of the first two.

 

- all bags (suitcases, non-carry-on) through x-ray before check-in, by United Airlines,

- both bags and body during check-in, but only on a spot basis, by United

- official airport security after immigration by the security firm hired by AoT, and

- a final United security check at the actual departure gate, focussed on the carry-on bags.

 

I'm only using United as the example because you did. Other airlines do much the same. Many/most airlines do none of the above, and trust the Airports of Thailand contractor to handle security at the single post-immigration, pre-departure-gate location.

 

The actual airport security, provided by the Loxley-ICTS consortium, a private joint-venture firm, is centralised.

 

.

 

Joe this is old news as Jacko already informed me of the security changes on an earlier post. Although his info was not entirely correct as he stated that the security check point was centeralized prior to immigration. I just went thru as Ⅰ am now sitting in the ANA lounge at Narita waiting for my connection to SFO. The security checks are now immediately after immigtration and they have consolidated from around 10 check areas to two. I could not tell if this change provides better security and it appears that United does not believe as I still have to do the physical checks before entering the boarding area. I depart early morning so the amount of time to pass thru security was the same, however latter in the day one may have a longer wait under the new setup since they went from around 10 check points to two.

[ozijeff 9]

Arriving INTO Poomi at about 8pm last night.

I just beat the gig queues through immigration

They made the green 'nothing to declare' line a free for all and just let everybody through after you collected your bags.

It doesnt appear they have enough x-ray machines or staff to cope with 5 aircraft arrivals at once.

However if there is only a few hundred people, I would suggest your bags are more likely to be scanned.

[jacko 8,813]

Joe this is old news as Jacko already informed me of the security changes on an earlier post. Although his info was not entirely correct as he stated that the security check point was centeralized prior to immigration. I just went thru as Ⅰ am now sitting in the ANA lounge at Narita waiting for my connection to SFO. The security checks are now immediately after immigtration and they have consolidated from around 10 check areas to two. I could not tell if this change provides better security and it appears that United does not believe as I still have to do the physical checks before entering the boarding area. I depart early morning so the amount of time to pass thru security was the same, however latter in the day one may have a longer wait under the new setup since they went from around 10 check points to two.

Pay attention Emil, I flew Business Class and said I went through Fast Track!

Mentioned in this very thread.

I was checked prior to passport control.

Edited October 21, 2009 by jacko

[joekicker 53]

I just beat the gig queues through immigration

 

They have queues of them now? Now THERE is a reason to wish to be younger.

 

.

[Emil 0]

Pay attention Emil, I flew Business Class and said I went through Fast Track!

Mentioned in this very thread.

I was checked prior to passport control.

 

Which post did you clearly state that you flew Business Class and said that you went through Fast Track? Rereading the post now at one time I can now see how it is implied. I've flown Business Class a couple times in the past and the process didn't differ from my other trips except for the time I was processed through the VIP, diplomat area because the plane was about to depart. Anyway there are two security check point areas for the non fast track traveler.

[jacko 8,813]

Which post did you clearly state that you flew Business Class and said that you went through Fast Track? Rereading the post now at one time I can now see how it is implied. I've flown Business Class a couple times in the past and the process didn't differ from my other trips except for the time I was processed through the VIP, diplomat area because the plane was about to depart. Anyway there are two security check point areas for the non fast track traveler.

I said in this thread that fast track security was now located prior to immigration...here...

I elected not to mention my class of travel then.

I posted that from the lounge........after having experienced it.

I would not have posted if I had not experienced it for myself.

I am sorry that was not clear enough for you.

The process at Bangkok has changed from 'a couple times in the past'....that is the point of the whole thread. For Fast Track and regular, it has changed.

[Emil 0]

I said in this thread that fast track security was now located prior to immigration...here...

I elected not to mention my class of travel then.

I posted that from the lounge........after having experienced it.

I would not have posted if I had not experienced it for myself.

I am sorry that was not clear enough for you.

The process at Bangkok has changed from 'a couple times in the past'....that is the point of the whole thread. For Fast Track and regular, it has changed.

 

That post was made on Sep 10th and you didn't mention that you had gone through Fast Track. I'll post of things that I haven't actually experienced but haven't observed. When I posted that prior to the security changes that BKK had about 10 security check points I hadn't gone through all of them, in fact I had only been through two of them. We didn't get involved in our discussion until nearly a month later after your Sep 10th post and when I click of the topic I go to last unread post. I don't go back and re read all of the posts so that post of yours back on the 10th of Sep was long gone from my memory especially since your post on Fast Track didn't pertain to me.

 

I know that the process have changed but the point of our discussion was whether that change was for the better. So far I haven't heard how this changed improved security or how they can go from about 20 security check stations to around 14 will expedite the security process.

[joekicker 53]

I know that the process have changed but the point of our discussion was whether that change was for the better. So far I haven't heard how this changed improved security or how they can go from about 20 security check stations to around 14 will expedite the security process.

 

Well, the claim is that Loxley didn't have enough security people to have full security under the old system, but they do under the new, consolidated system. They might be right - so that would improve security.

 

I haven't heard any complaints, so MAYBE this consolidation has also expedited the process -- or not made it worse to the point anyone complains.

 

.

[Emil 0]

Well, the claim is that Loxley didn't have enough security people to have full security under the old system, but they do under the new, consolidated system. They might be right - so that would improve security.

 

I haven't heard any complaints, so MAYBE this consolidation has also expedited the process -- or not made it worse to the point anyone complains.

 

.

 

I guess I'm just cyncial and thought they were trying to reduce their operating costs. So far they haven't impressed United with the increase in security as they are still doing the physical checks at the gate.

 

I don't think you'll see any long lines until high season kicks in, if it does this year. When I departed BKK on the 21st it took me all of about 5 minutes from the time I arrived at the United counter until I was finished with security. Immigration had two stations opened and I was the only one in the area, same with security.

 

Under the old system the quickest way through security was to use the security stations located on the lower level as most travelers were not aware of those locations.

Edited October 23, 2009 by Emil

[jacko 8,813]

That post was made on Sep 10th and you didn't mention that you had gone through Fast Track. I'll post of things that I haven't actually experienced but haven't observed. When I posted that prior to the security changes that BKK had about 10 security check points I hadn't gone through all of them, in fact I had only been through two of them. We didn't get involved in our discussion until nearly a month later after your Sep 10th post and when I click of the topic I go to last unread post. I don't go back and re read all of the posts so that post of yours back on the 10th of Sep was long gone from my memory especially since your post on Fast Track didn't pertain to me.

 

I know that the process have changed but the point of our discussion was whether that change was for the better. So far I haven't heard how this changed improved security or how they can go from about 20 security check stations to around 14 will expedite the security process.

Yes, thank you, I know what date I flew out of Bangkok.

I took my belt off just for the fun of it. How would I know the process if I had not experienced it... are you are just being pedantic?

If you did not read my posts, or refresh your memory of them, prior to commenting on them to Joe, saying that they are not entirely correct, well I think there is little point discussing anything with you.

 

The security check(s) was much improved for me, a quick one prior to immigration.

 

The usual passport/ boarding card one at the gate, but no further strip and search.

 

Also security has improved as per the posts for laffniv, 2 slices short and stinky, those posts were Oct 13th in case you need to refresh your memory.

[Emil 0]

Yes, thank you, I know what date I flew out of Bangkok.

I took my belt off just for the fun of it. How would I know the process if I had not experienced it... are you are just being pedantic?

If you did not read my posts, or refresh your memory of them, prior to commenting on them to Joe, saying that they are not entirely correct, well I think there is little point discussing anything with you.

 

The security check(s) was much improved for me, a quick one prior to immigration.

 

The usual passport/ boarding card one at the gate, but no further strip and search.

 

Also security has improved as per the posts for laffniv, 2 slices short and stinky, those posts were Oct 13th in case you need to refresh your memory.

 

What with this taking off of the belt? It not something that is only done for fast track as I've had to take mine off going through the regular security checks. So you mentioning about taking off your belt would mean the same thing to me as placing a laptop in a tray to go thru x-ray.

 

The comment to Joe was partially correct even if we disregard the Fast Track security check area. You had stated that their was one centeralized security check area when there are 2 areas for the regular travelers and another area for Fast Track so that would make 3 areas.

 

When I mentioned improvement in security it pertained to security, not how fast one can go through security. Even Roy mentioned that he thought that the new area would have to be enlarged to avoid

long line when air travel picks up.

 

Prior to this change I never had to wait for more than 2 travelers in the security line, but I used the security on the lower level that many were not aware existed.

[jacko 8,813]

What with this taking off of the belt? It not something that is only done for fast track as I've had to take mine off going through the regular security checks. So you mentioning about taking off your belt would mean the same thing to me as placing a laptop in a tray to go thru x-ray.

 

The comment to Joe was partially correct even if we disregard the Fast Track security check area. You had stated that their was one centeralized security check area when there are 2 areas for the regular travelers and another area for Fast Track so that would make 3 areas.

 

When I mentioned improvement in security it pertained to security, not how fast one can go through security. Even Roy mentioned that he thought that the new area would have to be enlarged to avoid

long line when air travel picks up.

 

Prior to this change I never had to wait for more than 2 travelers in the security line, but I used the security on the lower level that many were not aware existed.

Go and read the post again. I commented sardonically that it was awkward getting my passport out while holding my belt and pants up!

No, a passenger will use only 1 of the three security check areas. The same way as one would only use 1 of the 27 immigration officials.

Prior to the change, I always had to wait for more than 2 travelers in the security line, the checks at the entrance to the gate wings was always backed up, but late night (my regular departure time is 8pm-0100am), it is busy with long haul Western departures. Accepted that the lower level was often less crowded.... but it took a few trips for me to figure that out too. It depended on which airline lounge I came out of. That is another reason for centralising security, having to have dual operations (for both levels), is inefficient.

[Emil 0]

Go and read the post again. I commented sardonically that it was awkward getting my passport out while holding my belt and pants up!

No, a passenger will use only 1 of the three security check areas. The same way as one would only use 1 of the 27 immigration officials.

Prior to the change, I always had to wait for more than 2 travelers in the security line, the checks at the entrance to the gate wings was always backed up, but late night (my regular departure time is 8pm-0100am), it is busy with long haul Western departures. Accepted that the lower level was often less crowded.... but it took a few trips for me to figure that out too. It depended on which airline lounge I came out of. That is another reason for centralising security, having to have dual operations (for both levels), is inefficient.

 

Okay I found the post about getting your passport out and agree that would mean that your before security. But go back and look at your post (#27) where you stated that BKK had a single main security after immigration. They have 2 and that's what I had mentioned to Joe. I'm still not accepting that multiple security checkpoints are more efficient unless your talking about costs. BKK still has a security check area on the lower level, I'm guessing it for those making connections.

 

Just out of curiousity what's with the Fast Track security area? Are you on a moving walkway to the immigration offical which doesn't allow you to put your belt back on before leaving the security area?

[jacko 8,813]

Okay I found the post about getting your passport out and agree that would mean that your before security. But go back and look at your post (#27) where you stated that BKK had a single main security after immigration. They have 2 and that's what I had mentioned to Joe. I'm still not accepting that multiple security checkpoints are more efficient unless your talking about costs. BKK still has a security check area on the lower level, I'm guessing it for those making connections.

 

Just out of curiousity what's with the Fast Track security area? Are you on a moving walkway to the immigration offical which doesn't allow you to put your belt back on before leaving the security area?

No, it meant I was after security and was entering passport/ immigration checks.

As other passengers are coming through security checks, you need to pick up your belongings and sort of move out of the way instead of standing there at the end of the belt dressing. More intelligent behaviour is expected of one in Fast Track. The immigration check is nearby and one's hands are occupied. I only have the two. Thankfully, now at Bangkok, you only have to go through a single security check. The moving walkway you are confusing is likely the belt you are supposed to put your bag and belt on. No wonder the security for economy class is slow.