Rumor About Retirement Visa Income Proof

[Trvlr 50]

I hear a rumor the other day that from next year pensions and other sources of income will no longer be accepted as proof of income when applying for a retirement visa.

Everyone will have to deposit 800,000 baht in a bank to show they can support themselves.

 

This is a rumor, but rumors sometimes do come true. Has anyone heard anything of this sort, officially or unofficially?

Edited August 13, 2014 by Trvlr

[Idefix 2,275]

No,

and not even sure what you are talking about...

Visa? So outside Thailand?...

[Trvlr 50]

No,

and not even sure what you are talking about...

Visa? So outside Thailand?...

 

Did you even look at the headline? It says retirement visa.

And the rumor is about the proof of income required for retirement visas.

[Idefix 2,275]

Did you even look at the headline? It says retirement visa.

Yes I did read it, and who says Visa says Embassy or Consulate, outside Thailand.

So for which country is this rumour ?

[Bushcraft 2,579]

Well, I take this to mean anybody who applies for or extends what we (incorrectly but for convenience) call a 'retirement visa'.

There are plenty of people who can show adequate income from pensions etc., and it would be grossly unfair but not impossible for this rumour to be true.

Don't believe it though, it would serve no purpose except to swell the money on deposit in banks - er, perhaps reason enough ...

[Idefix 2,275]

Well, I take this to mean anybody who applies for or extends what we (incorrectly but for convenience) call a 'retirement visa'...

Immigration emitted just last week a new Police Order about Immigration rules

- dated of 30 June 2014 - the first one since 2008 ! -

and there is absolutely no change on the different amounts of money required

for the different cases, or on the different ways to prove it. :)

 

Changes are few: (ED via) and mainly adding some very particular cases (like dependent of a Thai child)...

 

 

Edit: Link towards ThaiVisa on this subject: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/749918-thai-immigration-issues-new-police-order-3272557-effective-august-29-2014/

and link to Rules 2014: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_id=278457

Edited August 13, 2014 by Idefix

[Gary 4,119]

When I lived in Jomtien, I had no problem with the US Embassy proof of income letter for my retirement extensions. When I moved upcountry, the Immigration office in Chiang Khan, didn't like the letter and forced me to jump through all sorts of hoops, including a trip to Bangkok to have it legalized at the Laksi government translation office. The boss there came right out and told me the letter means nothing because some people lie. I went ahead and made the 800,000 baht transfer from my US bank and have no problems since then.

 

I wouldn't be at all surprised if the proof of income letters will not be acceptable in the near future.

[atlas2 4,329]

My first extension was done using proof of income…… But I decided it was a pain to do... plus my consulate, (then in Pattaya) had me pay 2500bt for the letter.

 

So next year……used 800,000 baht in deposit account which I was told I could transfer to another account a week before submitting my application for another year extension. Worked fine... no problem.

 

The next year I was told by my bank I do do exactly the same. So I did.

 

Problem…….

….'Cannot'

'Why?'

"This account no good."

"But I do last year and it was OK"

"This year cannot..Must be in your other account for 3 months"

"But it wasn't in that account for 3 months…….What can I do?"

"You have pension?"

"Yes"

"Can use pension"

 

This coincided with the British Consulate in Pattaya being closed for a week. Had to get original docs sent special mail from UK. Then certified here in the Consulate, then back to Immigration with a day to spare.

 

Apart from being over sensitive to catheters protruding from shorts in Tescos……..I'm a 'belt and braces man'. Not expecting any problems I'd still allowed myself two weeks……..And on this occasion I was glad I did.

 

Point is…... whatever you hear from officials or read…... it can change.

 

I can't be arsed to go down the pension route ever again. It's even more of a hassle for Brits now we have to go to BKK.

 

If you've got it then money in the Bank's easy. Make sure the balance is over 800,000 for 3 months and then use it up…….

Edited August 13, 2014 by atlas2

[nkped 1,208]

Proof of a pension may be hard to verify. On the other hand, you read tales of people going to unconventional sources to get short term loans to establish their 800K bank account.

[jacko 8,813]

 

Did you even look at the headline? It says retirement visa.

And the rumor is about the proof of income required for retirement visas.

I have not heard this... and I read Thai Visa where rumours, even unlikely baseless ones, abound.

Some discussion of UK tax issues and Expats losing the tax free allowance.

 

Like others, I have heard that a few country's Embassy, will issue a guarantee letter quite readily without any verification, and hence one could be suspicious of the claimed pension. That would irritate the Thai immigration I am sure.

 

But you keep saying 'VISA' and emphasising that, so do you mean a Non-Imm-OA, retirement, obtained in your home country? Or actually the retirement 'extension' we can obtain in Thailand.

Edited August 14, 2014 by jacko

[Trvlr 50]

Well, I take this to mean anybody who applies for or extends what we (incorrectly but for convenience) call a 'retirement visa'.

There are plenty of people who can show adequate income from pensions etc., and it would be grossly unfair but not impossible for this rumour to be true.

Don't believe it though, it would serve no purpose except to swell the money on deposit in banks - er, perhaps reason enough ...

 

I am not sure why you say it is incorrect to call it a retirement visa. The stamp on my passport says in bold letters "RETIREMENT". To me that means I can correctly refer to it as a retirement visa. Besides, just about evryone refers to it as such, even officials.

It may have some official letter designation, but that is meaningless to most people.

[Trvlr 50]

I have not heard this... and I read Thai Visa where rumours, even unlikely baseless ones, abound.

Some discussion of UK tax issues and Expats losing the tax free allowance.

 

Like others, I have heard that a few country's Embassy, will issue a guarantee letter quite readily without any verification, and hence one could be suspicious of the claimed pension. That would irritate the Thai immigration I am sure.

 

But you keep saying 'VISA' and emphasising that, so do you mean a Non-Imm-OA, retirement, obtained in your home country? Or actually the retirement 'extension' we can obtain in Thailand.

 

I don't know that there is any difference in the proof of income. The document I obtained from the Los Angeles Thai consulate had exactly the same income requirement as the document given to me by Jomtien immigration. I actually showed the Thai consulate some of my papers documenting income, and they were fine with them. Exactly the same papers I was prepared to show the US Embassy folk here.

And if there is any change - in line with the rumor - then I am pretty sure it will apply wherever a retirement visa is obtained..

 

But it sounds like there is nothing behind the rumor. I hope not, because it will make life difficult for some people.

[nkped 1,208]

There are a few differences in the requirements and procedures. I checked the LA consulate web site the other day and saw that I could meet the financial solvency requirement with the equivalent of 800K in a U.S. account. On the other hand I don't believe you need police and medical certificates for an O-A extension. Just me, but I have greater confidence when I see a source talking about a nonimmigrant O-A. Those who shorten it to non O-A get me confused.

Edited August 14, 2014 by nkped

[MM 6,562]

I just call it retirement visa, just like the folks at immigration do when I speak to them.

 

[Gary 4,119]

I think that the bottom line is if you want a hassle free retirement extension, just put the 800,000 in a Thai bank. After you have your extension, you can live off that money until three months before the next extension. Top it back up and you are set for the next year.

 

A support extension (marriage) only needs 400,000 but That type requires you to jump through a lot of hoops. I couldn't live off 400,000 a year so that would not be very convenient anyways.

 

Face it, if you can't come up with 800,000 baht you really shouldn't be here.

[Idefix 2,275]

I just call it retirement visa, just like the folks at immigration do when I speak to them.

Yes MM, I know. Problem is that on a forum you must use the correct terminology or define precisely the context:

- if about someone who live in Thailand: it's an "Extension of Stay based on being over 50", aka "on Retirement"

- if from another country: probably about an "Long Stay" O-A Visa , or even just a non-O in some cases.

In the initial message, we didn't know which case it was, so I asked.

 

I am not sure why you say it is incorrect to call it a retirement visa. The stamp on my passport says in bold letters "RETIREMENT".

To me that means I can correctly refer to it as a retirement visa.

Except that it's not a Visa . You must just understand the definitions :

- a Visa is only an "Authorisation to Enter a country". It's checked by Immigration and if valid you get an "Authorisation of Stay"

- the stamp you got is an "Extension of Stay for reason of Retirement". You don't need a Visa as you are already "in". It's not a Visa: if you exit Thailand you cannot re-enter and lost your Authorisation! That's why you need a re-entry permit in this case.

Edited August 15, 2014 by Idefix

[Trvlr 50]

Yes MM, I know. Problem is that on a forum you must use the correct terminology or define precisely the context:

- if about someone who live in Thailand: it's an "Extension of Stay based on being over 50", aka "on Retirement"

- if from another country: probably about an "Long Stay" O-A Visa , or even just a non-O in some cases.

In the initial message, we didn't know which case it was, so I asked.

 

 

Except that it's not a Visa . You must just understand the definitions :

- a Visa is only an "Authorisation to Enter a country". It's checked by Immigration and if valid you get an "Authorisation of Stay"

- the stamp you got is an "Extension of Stay for reason of Retirement". You don't need a Visa as you are already "in". It's not a Visa: if you exit Thailand you cannot re-enter and lost your Authorisation! That's why you need a re-entry permit in this case.

 

I can see that there is some method behind the madness of board names. Your name must be a reflection of the French "idee fixe", a common meaning of which is: An idée fixe is a preoccupation of mind held so firmly as to resist any attempt to modify it, a fixation. And from Webster: an idea that dominates one's mind especially for a prolonged period : obsession

 

While I always appreciate someone introducing accuracy into proceedings - I am sure others do too - in this case I think you are merely introducing confusion. For some reason you do it every chance you get, to the point of... obsession.

 

First of all some semantics. "Visa" does not mean merely permission to enter. Implicit in the granting of a visa is the notion that a person is alowed to stay, usually for a defined period. Here is one definition plucked from the net (BusinessDictionary.com): Certificate issued or a stamp marked (on the applicant's passport) by the immigration authorities of a country to indicate that the applicant's credentials have been verified and he or she has been granted permission to enter the country for a temporary stay within a specified period.

So, your splitting of hairs regarding the retirement visa is inconsequential and confusing.

Another point you make - and I am not sure I have fully understood it - does not appear correct either. The Thai Los Angeles consulate does not grant only a "long-stay" visa. It gives a visa specifically for retirement. Here are a couple of quotes from their website:

For the purpose of retirement (Type “O-A”) ....

Effective Immediately - The visa fee for Non-Immigrant O-A Long-Stay (Retirement) visa is $200 - payable by cashiers check or money order only made payble to "Royal Thai Consulate General - Los angeles"

The income requirements are exactly the same as when applying in Jomtien. (Consulates have a few other requirements, not relevant to this discussion.)

Again, while I really do appreciate your desire for accuracy, will you please let us call it a retirement visa?

How about we do a trade? You stop jumping on us, and if I die in Thailand I will have engraved on my tombstone: Died While on "Extension of Stay for reason of Retirement".

[jacko 8,813]

I just checked mine.... it says 'Extension of Stay...is permitted up to...xxx'

 

Trvlr you have put a lot of effort into arguing, you remind me of sybarite (arno/cousin and more recently geno).

 

Nevertheless you cannot get a retirement visa in Jomtiem, but can in the USA. The requirements are not quite exactly matching, you would need a police report to obtain the visa.

I was confused in your OP whether you were discussing a Visa or Extension........

Getting the name right just helps people get the answers right too. In matters like this I think it is important to get the right answers.

 

Are you planning to retire to LOS?

Edited August 16, 2014 by jacko

[Idefix 2,275]

So, your splitting of hairs regarding the retirement visa is inconsequential and confusing.

Hey! You would have put "O-A" in your first message, there would have had not any confusion...

but we had to wait your message #13 to understand what you were talking about: an O-A from LA Consulate.

 

And despite what you are saying, requirements and procedures are different for Retirement Extension (inside Thailand)

and for O-A Visa (where requirements vary in each consulate/embassy/country...)

that's why it's important to be precise when talking about "visa rules".

[Trvlr 50]

I just checked mine.... it says 'Extension of Stay...is permitted up to...xxx'

 

Trvlr you have put a lot of effort into arguing, you remind me of sybarite (arno/cousin and more recently geno).

 

Nevertheless you cannot get a retirement visa in Jomtiem, but can in the USA. The requirements are not quite exactly matching, you would need a police report to obtain the visa.

I was confused in your OP whether you were discussing a Visa or Extension........

Getting the name right just helps people get the answers right too. In matters like this I think it is important to get the right answers.

 

Are you planning to retire to LOS?

 

You can argue till the end of time, but it won't make a difference to the fact. "Extension of stay" is a heading...what you are getting is a visa to stay in Thailand. By definition it is not a fish, it is not a passport, it is a visa! It is for retirement purposes, so it is a retirement visa.

[Trvlr 50]

Hey! You would have put "O-A" in your first message, there would have had not any confusion...

but we had to wait your message #13 to understand what you were talking about: an O-A from LA Consulate.

 

And despite what you are saying, requirements and procedures are different for Retirement Extension (inside Thailand)

and for O-A Visa (where requirements vary in each consulate/embassy/country...)

that's why it's important to be precise when talking about "visa rules".

 

No, you are just trying to confuse things. Go back and read my post. My question was very simple: has anyone heard about a change in financial requirements for obtaining retirement visas. It was not about any other procedure.

THAT requirement is the same wherever in the world you obtain the retirement visa.

So, what could have been answered with a simple "no" has turned into a long winded discussion about... nothing.

Crap.

[jacko 8,813]

 

You can argue till the end of time, but it won't make a difference to the fact. "Extension of stay" is a heading...what you are getting is a visa to stay in Thailand. By definition it is not a fish, it is not a passport, it is a visa! It is for retirement purposes, so it is a retirement visa.

And so can you and you will still be wrong.

But suit yourself.

I shall go and feed my dog, it is a cat actually, but has 4 legs and a tail so I can call it a dog if I wish and appear dumb.

[jacko 8,813]

 

No, you are just trying to confuse things. Go back and read my post. My question was very simple: has anyone heard about a change in financial requirements for obtaining retirement visas. It was not about any other procedure.

THAT requirement is the same wherever in the world you obtain the retirement visa.

So, what could have been answered with a simple "no" has turned into a long winded discussion about... nothing.

Crap.

You cannot obtain a retirement visa from where-ever in the world.

Only your home country.

[Trvlr 50]

You cannot obtain a retirement visa from where-ever in the world.

Only your home country.

 

I guess we should thank you for that nugget? But what relevance does it have to this thread?

That is what I meant by my reference to "arguing till the end of time" above. You always want the last word, even if you have to twist the argument to do so.

 

Yes, most of us realize that a Finn will get a retirement in Finland, an American in the US, and so on. Ever heard of the "impersonal you". Or do you need an English lesson too?

And you appear to be a moderator...what a travesty!

[jacko 8,813]

What makes you think I have to have the last word......

Thread Closed!

Edited August 18, 2014 by jacko