The Sportsman on Soi 13

[Evil Penevil 7,628]

The Sportsman is a popular UK-style pub and restaurant on Soi 13 that's been in operation for 20 years. It therefore pains me a bit to write a negative review of the meal I had at such a venerable establishment. I wish I could be more positive, considering The Sportsman's long history in Pattaya.

I stepped into The Sportsman on a whim Saturday afternoon. It had been at least five years since I'd last been there and I made a snap decision as I walked past to try it again. I was encouraged by the number of customers I saw on the veranda and inside. At least 10 were eating and another five or so were enjoying a drink, watching sports on the TVs or chatting with friends at the bar. Relative to most of its competitors, that's quite a few customers for 5 pm on a weekend afternoon and it raised my hopes the food might be good. The dining area was well-lit, clean and in excellent shape. I saw no indication of the scruffiness that mars too many bars in Pattaya and took it as another propitious sign.

Unfortunately, my hopes were soon dashed. A restaurant's popularity and decor/furnishings aren't always accurate predictors of the quality of its food. I choose the special of the day, which was described as, "Homemade Bowmans pie with cheese, onion and potatoes." Branston baked beans and french fries were the sides. I hadn't had a cheese, onion and potato pie since my childhood and I was eager to renew my acquaintance with this traditional British dish. I wondered if "Bowmans" could refer to a regional variation on the pie or even a special type of cheese, but it turns out that "Bowmans" is the brand name of Sportman's own line of sweet and savory pies. They are available in retail shops as well as in the restaurant.

I'm not a fan of either baked beans or french fries and toyed for moment with asking if I could substitute a small side order of salad for them. However, I abandoned that idea as specials don't usually allow substitutions and its often difficult to get waitresses to understand requests. I decided to go with the daily special in standard form. The wait for my meal was a very acceptable 20 minutes.

It wasn't an exciting plate of food to look at and got even less exciting once I tasted it. The french fries were lukewarm, soft and soggy, inedible in my book. They were U.S.-style fries that had only gone once, not twice, into the deep fryer, then been left to sit too long. The result was the antithesis of crispy.

The pie, the base of the meal, wasn't warm enough for me. I want a cooked meal to be piping hot when placed in front of me. Worse yet, the pie was flavorless. I could neither see nor taste any indication of cheese, onions or anything else in the pie. It seemed to be unseasoned mashed potatoes, maybe moistened with milk, in a shortcrust shell and top layer. As I recall, the cheese, onion and potato pies of my childhood had been seasoned with English mustard. The Bowmans pie didn't taste bad; it didn't taste anything. It was the definition of blandness.

It's a disappointing, even depressing, experience when beans from a can are the high point of a restaurant meal. I began to wonder what had been on the menu that afternoon at UK transport cafes, not to mention HM Prison Strangeways. The parts of the meal that could be messed up in preparation had been. There's not much that can go wrong with beans from a can. I guess they could be burned during reheating and at least that didn't happen.

The special cost 270 baht and a bottle of SML 90 baht. That's not expensive, but it isn't value for money, especially considering how little of it I actually ate. As I said earlier, it had been five years since I'd eaten at The Sportsman. I may give it another try in 2021.

A proviso: This review centers on the food I got one particular afternoon. It doesn't change the fact that many find The Sportsman a great place for a pub visit. Also, I may have caught The Sportsman on a bad day. A restaurant can't stay in business for 20 years by consistently serving food as bad as I got Saturday. However, the inability to serve up a decent savory pie and french fries doesn't inspire confidence that another selection from the menu would be better.

Evil

Edited March 6, 2016 by Evil Penevil

[jimmac 66]

Thanks for the review. Sorry you had such a poor experience. I've enjoyed the Sportsman many times while staying next door at the Sandy Spring. But my visits have almost always been for breakfast and their English breakfasts have always been excellent.

[js007 795]

The one time I ate breakfast there it wasn't so good. Never again.

[Fatboyfat 361]

Strange to take and post a photo of one of the more approachable managers in the business (1st photo), but not to have the common decency to convey one's gripes to him, before attempting a thinly disguised "hatchet job". There is already a recent Sportsman thread running, and yet you feel the need to start another.....I wonder why?

Just a quick suggestion, if you find baked beans so abhorrent (you mention this ad-finitum), or chips, then don't order them. The staff in the Sportsman (unless there has been a recent change of policy) speak very good English, and have always managed any "mix-and-match" request I have made on my albeit infrequent visits in the past.

[Evil Penevil 7,628]

Strange to take and post a photo of one of the more approachable managers in the business (1st photo), but not to have the common decency to convey one's gripes to him, before attempting a thinly disguised "hatchet job". There is already a recent Sportsman thread running, and yet you feel the need to start another.....I wonder why?

Just a quick suggestion, if you find baked beans so abhorrent (you mention this ad-finitum), or chips, then don't order them. The staff in the Sportsman (unless there has been a recent change of policy) speak very good English, and have always managed any "mix-and-match" request I have made on my albeit infrequent visits in the past.

Haven't I already answered you before on Addicts? It seems like deja vu all over again.

 

looks like you've done a pretty good hatchet job there mate. In pic 2 it looks like you are sitting next to the boss (big ears). He has always been a real gent and i am sure if you had shared your disappointment with him he would have tried to placate your concerns. I have always been pleased with the catering services from the sportsman ranging from the FREE pie and chips on the thursday night quiz to the sunday buffets. Good reputations take years to be won yet can be lost so easily. I would hate to think that this establishment would lose the high regards held by so many as a result of the odd off day!

OK, second verse, same as the first ...

 

A critical review isn't the same thing as a hatchet job. I wrote about my experience with Saturday's daily special at The Sportsman. The food I got wasn't good and my review simply reflects that. I had no idea who the two men at the bar were. I pixelated the face of one to preserve his privacy.

 

If I am a regular customer in a restaurant, I would politely call the manager's attention to any serious faults with the food. However, I've not found that a particularly effective tactic a when I'm unknown. It can lead to awkward moments. Besides, there's nothing the manager could have done to fix that meal short of replacing it entirely with something different.

 

So the manager was present yet you could not go to the trouble of complaining about your food. Yet you have gone to a lot of trouble to to write a "critical review" of the managers restaurant. This certainly does not bode well for that manager in the future as this piece of writing will hardly put bums on seats. You could have given the establishment an opportunity to right their wrongs before portraying their eatery in a negative light.

As I wrote earlier, I had no idea the guy in the white tee shirt was the manager. When I took the pic, I thought he was a customer chatting with a friend. Also as I explained earlier, under some circumstances I might complain about a bad meal, in other cases I won't go to the trouble. It depends on the situation, what mood I'm in, how much time I have, etc. On Saturday, I didn't feel it was worth the time and effort to complain.

 

But as a general principle, I don't think anyone is under an obligation to speak with the manager before writing a review, whether negative, positive or indifferent. It doesn't matter if the review will be posted to a punter board or TripAdvisor or published in the most illustrious food publication in the world. Writing an accurate account of what came down on the plate in front of you is the important part. No matter what sort of magic wand the manager at The Sportsman might have been able to wave, it wouldn't have changed the fact that my initial order was bad indeed. It's the bad food that puts The Sportsman in a negative light, not my review of it. I didn't go to more or less trouble in writing the OP in this thread than with any other review I've done.

 

There are dozens of negative reviews on the various punter boards, Facebook groups, TripAdvisor, etc. How many times has the reviewer spoken with the manager before posting the review?

 

And now, for something new:

 

There is already a recent Sportsman thread running, and yet you feel the need to start another.....I wonder why?

Before I post in that thread, it will be

 

 

Evil

Edited March 7, 2016 by Evil Penevil

[SimplySam 517]

It's not like there is such an abundance of recent threads that someone posting a thread similar to another should be criticized for that audacity.

[BeerBelly 1,026]

Thanks for the very well written review EP!

 

I had a similar experience to you about two years ago during my first and last visit to the Sportsman. Back then I had the Fish and Chips assuming the English would do this very well. But both the fish and chips were limp, nothing crispy on my plate at all. I figure the popularity of the place must be due to the difference in taste and expectations between the American pallet and the English pallet. In other words, what might not taste great to us, might bring back great childhood memories to the English so they love it. And this works the other way around as well, of course. I've seen plenty of negative comments/reviews of something like biscuits and gravy from the English.

[Evil Penevil 7,628]

Thanks for the very well written review EP!

 

I figure the popularity of the place must be due to the difference in taste and expectations between the American pallet and the English pallet. In other words, what might not taste great to us, might bring back great childhood memories to the English so they love it. And this works the other way around as well, of course.

I think you've hit it squarely. There are different conceptions of what is good food in various countries and sometimes these conceptions clash. That doesn't mean either side is "right" in terms of objective truth, but just that preferences aren't uniform across geographical borders. Case in point: boiled vegetables. What I think is way overcooked, many British consider to be OK. The type of "al dente" vegetable I prefer might get sent back by a British diner because it is under cooked. I've also noticed differing concepts of crispiness between the U.S. and the U.K. French fries I have thought were perfect- golden brown, crispy outside, fluffy inside- British friends have considered overcooked, almost burnt.

 

That's why I'm skeptical about complaining to a manager who doesn't know me. What I may not like or regard as badly cooked could be exactly what most of his customers enjoy. I've seen this happen before and it has indeed led to awkward situations. I have to add that quite a few British BMs have commented negatively on The Sportsman's food. A lot of them feel it was better before and has deteriorated in recent years.

 

Evil

Edited March 7, 2016 by Evil Penevil

[jacko 8,813]

Although it is not strictly against the rules, rule 18 suggests cross posting from this site to others requires permission.

Perhaps better to discuss local posts.

 

What is the rule on this wrt Addicts?

Edited March 7, 2016 by jacko

[Fatboyfat 361]

Although it is not strictly against the rules, rule 18 suggests cross posting from this site to others requires permission.

Perhaps better to discuss local posts.

 

What is the rule on this wrt Addicts?

I've no idea! I have never been a member of any forum other than this one and a couple of long defunct ones which started up before Pete invited us to join here. However, it is good to see I am not alone in disliking deliberate attempts to unnecessarily besmirch the local eateries; the hardest of the services to suceed in, and also the most prone when it comes to thoughtless reporting. A problematic situation with regards to the masses on Tripadvisor/Facebook etc, but one would have wished for a bit more decorum from a supposedly "Pattaya wise" forum. The fact that it has gone out to multiple forums pretty much shows intent. I guess that the Sportsman set up with it's other businesses such as their stake in Door2door, golf venues, taking on failing bar/restaurants and now "pie building" should maybe no longer be classed as "small fry"; and fair game for that type of dissemination to multiple forums, by the OP.

 

Edit in: Mistakenly thought Jacko might be referring to me in quoted post. Please ignore 1st sentence.

Edited March 8, 2016 by Fatboyfat

[Nightrider 340]

I have eaten in the sportsman to many times to remember and i have never had any reason to dislike the food i was served , it as always been good and that's the main reason i use the place , maybe they have a off day now and again but it's never happened to me....!

[Odense 489]

I know he does not really need help but:

Evil has consistently written good reviews on restaurants.

You can agree or disagree with him but unless you have more knowledge about the circumstances than was posted I don't think it is fair to accuse him of a "hatchet job"

 

 

 

Posted from my mobile so I blame any spelling errors on that.

Edited March 8, 2016 by Odense

[Evil Penevil 7,628]

This thread is proving interesting. One BM thanks me for a "very well written review," while another accuses me of doing a "hatchet job" and attributing dark motivations to my review. It's like one of those pictures that can be interpreted in two ways. What do you see in this picture?

However, it is good to see I am not alone in disliking deliberate attempts to unnecessarily besmirch the local eateries; the hardest of the services to suceed in, and also the most prone when it comes to thoughtless reporting. A problematic situation with regards to the masses on Tripadvisor/Facebook etc, but one would have wished for a bit more decorum from a supposedly "Pattaya wise" forum.

My review of The Sportsman is no different from any other review I've ever done. I ordered a meal, took pictures of the food I got and wrote up my reaction to it. In this case, it was a negative reaction based on what was on the plate in front of me. How is that any different from any other review by me or another BM?

Do you consider all negative restaurant reviews on Pattaya Talk to be "deliberate attempts to unnecessarily besmirch the local eateries;"? What is it that distinguishes my review of The Sportsman from any of the negative reviews of other restaurants by BMs who do food reviews?

The fact that it has gone out to multiple forums pretty much shows intent.

What intent is that?

I have been posting food reviews (as well as bar reviews, trip reports, analysis, etc) to multiple boards for years. Take a look at the links in my signature. Except for the first one, all the others have been posted to Addicts, TPC and Live in addition to Talk. Ten years ago, I was posting to 11 different punter boards, not all of them Pattaya-centered. In total, I've probably posted to 25 different boards or blogs over the years. Many don't exist any longer; others are only the faintest shadows of their former selves so I no longer bother with them.

In almost every case, I started posting to a board because I was asked to do so by the Admin or member of that board.

I guess that the Sportsman set up with it's other businesses such as their stake in Door2door, golf venues, taking on failing bar/restaurants and now "pie building" should maybe no longer be classed as "small fry"; and fair game for that type of dissemination to multiple forums, by the OP.

Wow! That's quite a conspiracy theory! I have no idea who owns The Sportsman, nor was I aware of the owner's (or owners') other business interests. In fact, I thought a Bowmans Pie might be an occupational name like Sheperd's Pie or Ploughman's Lunch. Until I googled it, I didn't know The Sportsman had a pie-making sideline called Bowmans. But according to its Web site, it's also been around for many years.

 

It's really silly to think that such a substantial operation like you say The Sportsman is could be threatened by a single bad review of one meal.

 

One final question: Is the owner and/or manager of The Sportsman a friend of yours? Have you known him (them?) for a long time?

 

Evil

Edited March 8, 2016 by Evil Penevil

[Evil Penevil 7,628]

I know he does not really need help but:

 

 

Believe me, I am thankful for all the help I can get.

 

Evil

[Fatboyfat 361]

 

One final question: Is the owner and/or manager of The Sportsman a friend of yours? Have you known him (them?) for a long time?

 

Evil

And one final retort.

No, none of them are friends or even acquaintances of mine. I have been aware of the manager for just about as long as I have been visiting the establishment (not frequent), his movements and actions around the bar are self-evident. I did profer a complaint to him a few years back, about the removal of what was a very good "Prawn Salad" from the menu, and his explanation was apologetic, pleasant and ultimately for good reason, and we have been on "silent nodding terms" since then.

My thoughts and sentiments have nothing to do with personal battles, and as far as I know, I have tried to be consistent on this theme. I am sure I posted almost exactly the same sort of response to a negative report on another popular Indian restaurant.

I have been a 1/3 owner of a restaurant in the UK though, that was seriously affected by a similar one off complaint, by letter in local newspaper. The compensation received after court action amounted to little more than an apology. Yes I am sure the Sportsman will carry on regardless, and they have been known to take actions in the past, if they deemed it necessary. (Tony/Roland alledgedly when frequenting Soi Yamato was one! )

[Odense 489]

And one final retort.

No, none of them are friends or even acquaintances of mine. I have been aware of the manager for just about as long as I have been visiting the establishment (not frequent), his movements and actions around the bar are self-evident. I did profer a complaint to him a few years back, about the removal of what was a very good "Prawn Salad" from the menu, and his explanation was apologetic, pleasant and ultimately for good reason, and we have been on "silent nodding terms" since then.

My thoughts and sentiments have nothing to do with personal battles, and as far as I know, I have tried to be consistent on this theme. I am sure I posted almost exactly the same sort of response to a negative report on another popular Indian restaurant.

I have been a 1/3 owner of a restaurant in the UK though, that was seriously affected by a similar one off complaint, by letter in local newspaper. The compensation received after court action amounted to little more than an apology. Yes I am sure the Sportsman will carry on regardless, and they have been known to take actions in the past, if they deemed it necessary. (Tony/Roland alledgedly when frequenting Soi Yamato was one!)

So - you think that there should be no negative reviews ?

 

Posted from my mobile so I blame any spelling errors on that.

[Evil Penevil 7,628]

I am sure I posted almost exactly the same sort of response to a negative report on another popular Indian restaurant.

That was a very different set of circumstances- and your response was different, too. The post about the Indian restaurant was a brief one in which the OP claimed he'd gotten "terrible diarrhea" from eating there. He titled his report " Avoid (name of restaurant)" and the word "Avoid" was soon deleted by the mods. Also, the OP has never logged into Talk again after making that post.

 

That was not a review, but a warning made on shaky grounds. I never claimed anyone got sick at The Sportsman, nor did I urge anyone not to eat there. I simply reported on the meal I got.

 

Here was your response to the post about the Indian restaurant:

 

Yeah I don't like these hatchet jobs on the basis of one person with one meal. The restaurant businesses, which are one of the hardest lines to suceed in, can be severely affected by these sort of gripes. Not such a problem on this type of "Pattayaly Wise" forum, but a nightmare on things such as Tripadvisor. Mass incidences are fair game though. Last year, a friend that we were dining with, ended up with some kind of food poisoning, almost certainly caused by oysters, from one of the most prestigous restaurants in Pattaya (begins with a B ). Neither he, nor I, would even consider putting that sort of post down on the basis of that one off experience. I believe he did notify the restaurant in question, but don't know the outcome. (My other half also had the same oysters and was unaffected, so it was quite likely a lone rogue mollusc).

I've only eaten once at Little India, but found it OK and a a lot better than most Ruby houses in Pattaya. I actually like "the green stuff" with kebabs too! : Mint raita I believe.

Even though the OP in that thread had made much more serious remarks about the Indian restaurant than I did about The Sportsman, you didn't go to near the same length in criticizing his motivation for his warning as you did regarding my review. You seemed to regard the diarrhea warning as an unfortunate incident, not a deliberate attempt to unjustly disparage the restaurant.

 

Evil

Edited March 8, 2016 by Evil Penevil

[Butch 3,456]

Hi Evil

I think, or understand that the Sportsman has something to do with "Robins Nest" on Soi Diana as well perhaps?.

 

Thanks for an impartial and detailed review, Evil, as you say, the Sportsman has been a stalwart of Pattaya for the last 20 years and it has had (and still does have) a good reputation for providing decent food as well as being the "go to" business for outside catering for some of the GoGo bars / Beer bar parties.

 

I will agree the dish looked unattractive, the beans seemed to "flood" the plate and perhaps overwhelm the other items there. My personal experiences there have always been consistently good, however I have adjusted my expectations accordingly. A home made pie should have better pastry and filling, and needed better presentation, and upon reading your review I read it as it's an item and dish that isn't up to standard rather than the Restaurant itself.

 

My only "criticism" is that you decided not to ask for a substitute, but I also understand your reluctance to do so. I have to agree with Fatboyfat that the Staff at the Sportsman are nothing if not helpful and understanding, many of them long term employees.

 

Like many restaurants of this style (P&W, Rosie O Grady's, Butchers Arms, Queen vic etc etc) I think their customer demographic is perhaps less discerning in their palate and as such they operate in a wider comfort zone when it comes to serving food, which is reflected in the dish you have reviewed here.

 

Cheers

Butch

[jacko 8,813]

Perhaps you should return Evil and try something a little more challenging than pie and chips with beans?

I hear well of the Sunday roast.

[Evil Penevil 7,628]

Perhaps you should return Evil and try something a little more challenging than pie and chips with beans?

I hear well of the Sunday roast.

That's my plan for 2021.

 

Seriously, if for any reason I get an unsatisfactory meal at a restaurant, I usually wait quite a while before going back. The exception would be if I've had several good meals previously and then get a bad one. I would figure the restaurant had an off day and give it another try. But if I reported on it, I would make no bones it wasn't good. I forget which chef said it, but there's a quote that goes something like, "A restaurant is only as good as the most recent meal it served."

 

Evil

[jacko 8,813]

That's my plan for 2021.

 

Seriously, if for any reason I get an unsatisfactory meal at a restaurant, I usually wait quite a while before going back. The exception would be if I've had several good meals previously and then get a bad one. I would figure the restaurant had an off day and give it another try. But if I reported on it, I would make no bones it wasn't good. I forget which chef said it, but there's a quote that goes something like, "A restaurant is only as good as the most recent meal it served."

 

Evil

Oh well, perhaps we can get the other great food critic Gabor to return then.

[Odense 489]

Oh well, perhaps we can get the other great food critic Gabor to return then.

Or perhaps MM - but they are busy people :-)

 

Posted from my mobile so I blame any spelling errors on that.

Edited March 9, 2016 by Odense

[Evil Penevil 7,628]

Although it is not strictly against the rules, rule 18 suggests cross posting from this site to others requires permission.

Perhaps better to discuss local posts.

 

What is the rule on this wrt Addicts?

On Addicts, rule 28 says, "its against the rules to show protected content to non members." The Addicts' posts I quoted came from an area of the board which isn't protected ("Restaurants, Cafe's, Take Aways & Nightlife Venues" in the Public Forum.)

 

Evil

Edited March 13, 2016 by Evil Penevil

[MM 6,562]

On Addicts, rule 28 says, "its against the rules to show protected content to non members." The Addicts' posts I quoted came from an area of the board which isn't protected ("Restaurants, Cafe's, Take Aways & Nightlife Venues" in the Public Forum.)

 

Evil

Same here. No foul.

 

Rules 12 and 18 cover the infractions

 

 

12) The parts of this site that require a password to access may not be shown to any person who is not a member.

18) Copying or crossposting information from the member's section of this site to any other website, without first gaining approval from the author of the post(s) is not allowed. If you see such a crossposting of your work or another's, you are invited to bring it to the attention of the moderators via PM.

Either way, you're in the clear, esp since you are the author.

[BigDUSA 71]

That's why I'm skeptical about complaining to a manager who doesn't know me. What I may not like or regard as badly cooked could be exactly what most of his customers enjoy. I've seen this happen before and it has indeed led to awkward situations. I have to add that quite a few British BMs have commented negatively on The Sportsman's food. A lot of them feel it was better before and has deteriorated in recent years.

 

Evil

I was a regular customer at Gregg's Kitchen for years. I'd eat there at least once or twice a day. One time I ordered a pizza and it was the worst pizza I ever ate. Gregg was in England at the time. I waited until he returned and I talked to him privately about what happened. He apologized and said he would make me another one. I said I'd come back in a day or two for the pizza. I come back and asked for my free pizza. He gets very angry and threatens to beat the shit out of me. Needless to say I was taken aback by his reaction. I never went back and I would walk by when he was sitting outside and head to Tropical Bert's on soi 6/1. He lost a steady customer and I never recommended his restaurant again.