the saddest sight

[funtimes 0]

ok, so i'm walking with my girlfriend down one of the sois and i spot this thing crawling on the rainy street. i look again and its a badly disfigured beggar slithering along his belly with a cup in his hands. never seen anything so sad and pitiful in my entire life. i wish id helped him out. poor guy. you see so much screwed up shit in pattaya you almost get numb to it.

[York 0]

You're right. Its a sad sight to see but those beggers make more money than average working Thais 2+ folds over. The whole thing is a big scam. The "boss" of those beggers make the most money. He plants those beggers throughout Pattaya at strategic tourist sites where tourists are the target. They drop them off in the morning and pick them up in the evening/night and they must fill the quota or else. Its been going on since I could remember. They even rent babies so they can beg for more money. Classic case of child abuse. Pattaya police cracks down every once in while but continue to thrive on naive tourists. It's a lucative, sad and disgusting business.

Edited September 21, 2006 by York

[funtimes 0]

You're right. Its a sad sight to see but those beggers make more money than average working Thais 2+ folds over. The whole thing is a big scam. The "boss" of those beggers make the most money. He plants those beggers throughout Pattaya at strategic tourist sites where tourists are the target. They drop them off in the morning and pick them up in the evening/night and they must fill the quota or else. Its been going on since I could remember. They even rent babies so they can beg for more money. Classic case of child abuse. Pattaya police cracks down every once in while but continue to thrive on naive tourists. It's a lucative, sad and disgusting business.

 

 

scam huh? haha. then again, everything in pattaya is phony. phony sunglasses, phony love, even phony friends who leave you when the drinks stop coming. it all kind of turned me off and made me disgusted. i got to the point later in my trip where i wasnt even tipping anymore. always paranoid about people scamming me. whadaya think i should do next time, put a rock in his cup and play the violin?

Edited September 21, 2006 by funtimes

[glynbuk 29]

it may be a scam and it may not, who knows, but i prefer to give a few baht every now and again just in case

[Krowdon 0]

For many, the tipping or donations is for the monger’s peace of mind, letting them believe their doing a good thing, not as much as for the person actually begging. If that’s the case, coins here and there are well spent, even if a scam is at hand. If it’s genuine, then two have benefited. Seems it’s a win/win situation…

[Tengotodo 52]

my 2 baht.. Yeah, it may be a "scam", but the dude really has no legs and only stumps for arms. I'm sure the few baht you give him will help him eat. I probably have more baht drop out of my pocket on a drunk night than that guy makes all week. Most of the time I see people step right over or around them trying to look the other way. I feel very fortunate when I see them.

[dave_boo 0]

I'm going to go with the general consensus here and say that I'd rather error on the side of caution. A 20 or 100 bhat note will NOT put me in the poor house and it helps my kharma. What that person does after that is purely up to them, but I've done the 'good' thing in this instance and will stand by my decision.

[Chivas 0]

You're right. Its a sad sight to see but those beggers make more money than average working Thais 2+ folds over. The whole thing is a big scam. The "boss" of those beggers make the most money. He plants those beggers throughout Pattaya at strategic tourist sites where tourists are the target. They drop them off in the morning and pick them up in the evening/night and they must fill the quota or else. Its been going on since I could remember. They even rent babies so they can beg for more money. Classic case of child abuse. Pattaya police cracks down every once in while but continue to thrive on naive tourists. It's a lucative, sad and disgusting business.

 

So bloody what if they make 10 times the average Thai does in a month !!

 

They are the poor sods moving around on stumps not you.

 

Chivas

[Florida Guy 0]

I'm going to go with the general consensus here and say that I'd rather error on the side of caution. A 20 or 100 bhat note will NOT put me in the poor house and it helps my kharma. What that person does after that is purely up to them, but I've done the 'good' thing in this instance and will stand by my decision.

 

I'll go along with that. Heck, I'd MUCH rather give those poor souls a few Baht than those a-holes outside of Mike's collecting for the "Thai Boy Scouts" ... yeah right!

[bizzjet 0]

I know the guy you mean, be careful you don't trip over him when you get up from your bar stool. He slithers around under your feet so be careful. What a guilt trip if you do.

 

Worse thing I ever saw was a child begging for a drink of water in Mumbai India. She had this plastic water bottle and was pointing it indicating she needed a drink. Now that was gut wrenching. She couldn't have been more than 5 years old.

[phw10 0]

I agree with majority. Even if it is a scam, at least you feel better for dropping a couple of baht in the cup. And it may help him make his quota.

 

There are worst things than stumps for hands. Did you read that in China the doctors transplanted a penis on some poor guy. Worst his wife didn't like it so they took it off. No joke I saw it while I was reading MSN about the coup.

[Shuggy 8]

Ive seen my fair share of beggars in Cambodia and Vietnam. If you are worried that they are being run or pimped, them take them to the nearest street stall and buy them some food. Don't know about Thailand but in Cambodia and Vietnam i've never had one say no or seem pissed off with me. They seemed more than grateful. Especially the street kids in Cambodia who are definately being organised.

 

Alternatively do both. Is the price of a beer or two going to make a big difference to you? Some of the Cambodian ones speak basic English and its interesting to sit down and talk to them.

[York 0]

I'm not saying what to do with your money. If you want to donate money to those organized beggers, then do so. But what I'm saying is that those beggers are pimped by the local mafia who scams tourists over this.

I used to donate in my early years in Thailand but experienced expats told me about the scam, well as local Thais. So I'm telling board members about this common scam thats going on for years, since many don't know about it.

Like the bar girls say "up to you" with your money. However, I do recommend donating to well known charity organizations in Pattaya, instead to local heartless, disgusting mafia pimp.

Edited September 23, 2006 by York

[KhunFred 0]

Here's the way I look at it. Scam or not...I do NOT have to do that for a living and for that I feel blessed. If I can lighten the load of some poor third world sap, then I feel better about myself. Most of the population in Thailand will never know the standard of living I enjoy, and I'm only a middle-class working stiff. I just feel like it's good public relations to "pass it along". Just my two bahts worth. :)

[whitespider 1]

I'm not saying what to do with your money. If you want to donate money to those organized beggers, then do so. But what I'm saying is that those beggers are pimped by the local mafia who scams tourists over this.

I used to donate in my early years in Thailand but experienced expats told me about the scam, well as local Thais. So I'm telling board members about this common scam thats going on for years, since many don't know about it.

Like the bar girls say "up to you" with your money. However, I do recommend donating to well known charity organizations in Pattaya, instead to local heartless, disgusting mafia pimp.

 

York - I have lived in Thailand now for 5 years so am one of the "experienced ex-pats" you refer to. I have heard all the "scam/mafia" stories but never actaully seen any proof.

 

If they are "picked up" at night why are they all sleeping in the street where they work or on the walkways over the roads??

 

Even if it IS a scam - the fact remains that these people will NOT eat unless you give money.

[Carraig 1]

Yous are all wrong!!

The saddest sight in Pattaya was me leaving the Areca last Sunday at 4 30 pm, to go home when the girls were all heading to work walking and wizzing by me with their bar gear on

[thechairman18 174]

Yes its a dilemma, and there is no real answer to the question.

I've seen the guy you are referring to, and some years ago saw a guy same, same in Patpong BKK.

My own feelings about beggars, is that I tend to ignore them, which at times is heart wrenching, as if you give to one, you should give to them all.

But obviously, you can't do that.

On my last trip, I was having a meal in Kiss Food on 2nd rd, and there were 2 German? couples on the next table to me.

Along comes a Thai couple, they were looking so sad, he was playing one of those vertical Pan Pipe sort of thing, and she was looking so pitiful begging for the money.

She stood over their table, and didn't move till they gave her some money.

They got up and left, but I was still waiting for my food.

A few minutes later as I was eating , I looked across to the massage parlour on the other side of the arcade, and the guy was talking on a mobile phone. FFS .

When, and if I see the Thai's dropping something in a beggar's pot, then I will do the same.

 

thechairman18

[PattayaPete 530]

I am sad to say that yes it is a scam and that by donating money you are helping tp perpetuate the scam. You are not helping these people by giving money, you are hurting them. Same with the kids selling chewing gum. You will not see genuine beggars in Pattaya or around the farang areas of Bangkok. It is all tied up and controlled by bad people.

 

The Bangkok police recently issued a press release asking people and especially tourists not to give money to these people. The police have a lot of trouble trying to control the situation as there is just too much money being made. The gang leaders are well connected and pay large kickbacks to authorities.

 

The reason you see these people out at night, five and six year old kids included, is because their bosses send them out at times when farangs are about. Babies are shared out among the group and often "perform" 24 hours a day with different "mothers". All the money they get is given to the bosses, who in return provide them with minimal food and terrible living conditions. A lot of the beggars are illegal immigrants from Cambodia and Myanmar specially brought in by the gangs. Some have been intentionally disfigured to improve their pittifulness.

 

It is understandable that farangs feel bad when they see these poor people and want to help. That is what the scam is based on. If you genuinely want to help the less fortunate then give to one of the many legitimate charities in Thailand. There are many options you can choose and your money will really do some good rather than hurting these poor people even more.

 

The Pattaya Orphanage and the Street Kid Centre are obvious examples.

 

If you do not have the time or inclination to get involved with organised giving and you feel strong pity for a beggar, then take them to a restaurant or street stall and buy them some food. That way you will at least know they are getting some benefit from your giving.

 

As for the guy with no legs that slithers along on his belly. I have seen him "after work". He has a nice clean set of clothes that he changes into and artificial legs which enable him to walk perfectly well.

[elef 0]

I agree 100 % with Pete, I've seen a lorry distribute the beggars on Beach Rd in the morning once. Also one time saw a paralysed man on the pavement outsite the bars hanging on Sabai Land. He asked for money and moved slowly sitting on his ass until a thai man tried to kick him out on the street, a miracle happened and the paralysed man run over 2nd Rd and disappeared in the crowds.

[Bullfrog 2,224]

The problem in Thailand is that the beggars suffer the backlash from poorer Asian countries where the local Mafia, or sometimes the police, control them, Indonesia for example. Self mutilation has also been known. ( No I have not seen somebody chop their own arm off so I have no proof).but not in Thailand.

 

My answer is that if the physical handicap is such that they won't be able to work I slip them 20. I never give to any other street beggar but give to organised charities...

[pat-uk 0]

wondering how long that guy who has no legs has been going up and down Walking street in his adapted bike selling flowers. I've seen him their for about 7 years, just wondering how long he's actually been doing it for ? i have a lot of respect for people who are disabled but actually make an effort to do something to make a living rather than beg?

[joes3175 0]

Hey bullfrog, Indonesia is a wrong example! I just come back from Java and been traveling from Jakarta to Surabaya (Semarang,Jogya etc) and hardly saw any beggars. I saw a few in Jogyakarta in front of the Plaza,

and one in a small town 40km from Surabaya. On my 4 weeks stay in Indonesia I saw less beggars in whole Java than on my way home (1/2 hr) in Melbourne! Beside that Indonesians do help the unfortunate ones, so most of them dont have to beg. If they beg 90% of their "income" is coming from locals. (Bali is exeption).

 

I just wonder why is that so many of us foreigners become so mean, Scrooge in poor countries, try to negotiate a $3 T/shirt to $2 in Indonesia or have a nervous brak down if they charge 60B for a beer instead of advertised 50B in Thailand.

 

Why dont you just put your small change in your back pocket when you receive it in the supermarket,shops etc, and give it to the needy when you see them, instead of thinking up excuses why not to give???? YOU WILL FEEL BETTER!

[Bullfrog 2,224]

Hey bullfrog, Indonesia is a wrong example!

Hi Mate I lived there for a year in '96, Jakarta and Bandung, and experienced begging daily and I am very pleased things have changed for the better.

 

Why dont you just put your small change in your back pocket when you receive it in the supermarket,shops etc, and give it to the needy when you see them, instead of thinking up excuses why not to give???? YOU WILL FEEL BETTER!

This is exactly what I do!!! As I said in my mail I don't need it to be one to one and see their faces to make me feel good. I give to organised charities in Patts. I do it to make THEM feel better not me.

[joes3175 0]

Organised Charities in Australia --and I belive all around the world-- use up to 95% of the donations for "administrative costs" Most of them take about 40-60% of the donation. I use to have foster chilren with world children fund in Brazil, Uganda,Mongolia and from my ca $500 donation they received just a bit over half of that amount. The kidds use to write us letters.

Around Melburne,Sydney are professional beggers who ask donations for charities and geting paid+commission. Some of theam earn much more than if they work, up to 2-3 times!

So either we go ahead with Soros or Gates foundations or had out the money to the needy ourself if we want to make shoure that 100% of our hard earned money will end up with the needy. Personaly I dont suport the Gates idea of helping AIDS wictims, as they helping anyone with Aids in poor countries. In my book if someone get the aids by sharing needle (drugs) or pracising unsafe sex, they just get what they

deserve, and I wouldnt give a cent for them.

[Bullfrog 2,224]

So from the Worldwide perspective you suggest we should stop giving to local orphanges?

 

There is one option that I once carried out up North , much to the disgust of the crooked Head Teacher, and employ people yourself to carry out building work etc.