The screw keeps on turning... extensions of stay!.

[jacko 8,822]

Or as many call them marriage and retirement visas... but in reality they are Extensions to Permissions of Stay, issued by domestic immigration, based on marriage or retirement, not visas. We have all heard the recent fuss as 4 Embassies stopped issuing the obligatory 'income letters'. But Immigration accommodated them by offering a proof of income into Thailand alternative. Show us the money being transferred in every month.

A lot of complaints, but it was an alternative.

I laid back smugly thinking I can easily continue with my 800k retirement based extension, money seasoned for 3 months each renewal!

Now in a move to apparently eliminate the agent bypassing this method, the rules (goalposts) are to be moved again. Rather than sorting out the devious shenanigans in immigration (how else does an Expat get an Extension if he doesn't demonstrate the cash in a Thai bank account), my regular method is to be made somewhat more onerous. Surely it would be simpler to just mandate all applications are made in person, or find out who stamps all the applications the agents bring in, a pile of passports.

Maybe it also ensures an Expat has cash available for medical treatment, removing the other rumour of obligatory medical insurance! Get treated, spend the money, and then have to leave!

But one has to think they just want rid of us!

Here it is,,,,,

Foreigners now need to keep 800k in Thai bank for three months AFTER retirement extension is granted.

Confirmed in police order No. 35/2561, foreigners who apply for a retirement extension using the 800k baht in the bank or the combination of income method now need to keep 800k baht in the bank for three months after the extension and 400k baht in the bank after that

Source. Thai Visa.

 

 

Edited January 31, 2019 by jacko

[atlas2 4,329]

Thanks Jacko........I got this info sent to me by an, 'I told you so' friend who'd had the conniptions over the first reports of changes and when I said it doesn't mention any difference to the seasoned sum.....Well it didn't then.....Well it does now so I expect he'll be happy.

We don't have to like ........just have to lump (sum) it.

 

 

Edit. Be good if we could keep the sum in an account that bares reasonable interest.

Edited February 1, 2019 by atlas2

[forcebwithu 4,856]

This really sucks as it means we now have to tie up 400,000 in a Thai account forever earning fuck all. It’s too late for me now to go the monthly transfer route of 65K/month, but I’ll be doing that after my extension to stay comes due in November.

[Bazle 1,500]

I am eagerly awaiting the rules regarding having the funds in the account for 3 months after the extension.

I'm in and out of the country frequently, and it might well be that I won't be around at the precise time of the 3 months after. If they are going to be flexible and let me establish that I've maintained the funds appropriately, say, at the time of the next renewal, fine, no problem. Otherwise, I foresee difficulties.

[nkped 1,208]

The wording on the 65K a month option is interesting.  Unlike an earlier iteration, it doesn't seem to be limited to pension deposits.  No, I'm not counting on that possibility.  I have been to Bangkok Bank and did the forms to open a direct deposit account and to deposit a qualifying monthly check to it.

[Dave 22]

Ok this rule is fine in theory, how are they going to check when they are now discussing doing away with the 90 day reporting.

Perhaps they will ask your  permission to allow access to your  online banking LOL

[js007 795]

It's probably not a bad idea to keep 800,000 baht in a Thai bank at all times, just as an emergency cushion.  And depending on your currency at home, it might turn out to be a profitable move.  

[jacko 8,822]

6 hours ago, js007 said:

It's probably not a bad idea to keep 800,000 baht in a Thai bank at all times, just as an emergency cushion.  And depending on your currency at home, it might turn out to be a profitable move.  

Well it looks like 800k plus money to live off or income method is obligated. In reality 800k/5 months and 400k /7, but a FD account, left alone is simpler! There is a bit of a rumour these changes do not apply to those who have already been doing retirement extensions for 10 consecutive years, but I read pre Oct 1998 has different conditions grandfathered in. Might learn more as time unfolds.

[forcebwithu 4,856]

8 hours ago, js007 said:

It's probably not a bad idea to keep 800,000 baht in a Thai bank at all times, just as an emergency cushion.  And depending on your currency at home, it might turn out to be a profitable move.  

I agree, but under the new rules the minute you use any of the 800k for an emergency during the five month period around your extension date you've invalidated your visa.

Another point about the new rules is they've effectively increased the 800k requirement to 1.255 million. To arrive at this number I used their 65k/month as a minimum income requirement then figured for five months I'll be able to live off the 800k deposit, but for the remaining seven months I'll need an additional 455k (7 * 65) brought over.

Good we still have the monthly income method to use as I'll be using that method after my next extension.

[jacko 8,822]

1 hour ago, forcebwithu said:

I agree, but under the new rules the minute you use any of the 800k for an emergency during the five month period around your extension date you've invalidated your visa.

It doesn't seem tenable that way. Anyhow the 2 month, 800k seasoning precedes the next extension and is the requirement for that, not the past/ current one. The 800k for 3 months after issue, and the 400k for the rest of the year is the fear factor. I just cannot believe there would be a punishment that retroactively invalidates the extension stamp in one's passport. (Yet I believe that is the case for a marriage extension or work permit, ie you get divorced or sacked you can be immediately on overstay or given 7 days). Will immigration use the preceding year's bank balance as a condition of a subsequent granting of an extension, or can it possibly invalidate a current one?

I agree, it looks like we need to keep 800k untouched in the bank and pull in living expenses on the top of that making it more of a burden. Suddenly income method (65k every month from overseas) is looking attractive! 

It appears they have made a bit of a confusion to clear up.

 

Edited February 3, 2019 by jacko

[atlas2 4,329]

Let the info' season a while.........

I'd still rather transfer one SWIFT a year. 12 months of the swings and roundabouts of exchange rates! I'm neurotic enough as it is.........Plus regular bank charges for comparatively small amounts all add up my boy.

Now i'm over 65 I more or less have to self-insure and I currently keep in a separate account 400,000.  My plan was to add 50,000 from time-to-time........up to about 700,000. Now it seems we can't go below 400,000 in our main account.....I don't see point of keeping things separate. 

So I'll carry on saving for the coming calamity..............Understanding that 'birth is a death sentence'........ keep calm and drink my Yorkshire Gold.  

[GeeGee 79]

My understanding was that you can combine both sources of income eg. if you proved a monthly income of say B30,000 (Amounts to B360,000 / year), then it would only be necessary to keep B800,000 - B360,000 in the bank ie. B440,000.

That's what the KeyVisa Retirement Calculator suggests.

 

[yogi100 1,925]

They don't really want us in their country on a long term basis and as they are becoming more prosperous they are raising the goalposts a notch at a time. They want you buying and investing in businesses and houses and condos so they can then rip you off but that's as far as it goes. They also want the falang tourists well enough who are spending 50K a week but not old fogeys who are likely to snuff it with just a few baht in the Kasikorn to their name.

The old catch phrase 'rent don't buy' is now beginning to more make sense with every passing year.

They are preparing the way for the Chinese millionaires who will soon be on their way. That's who they want, their own type (race) of people people. The scornful looks and attitudes from the staff in the supermarkets should tell you all you need to know.

It would be fun to watch their reaction if Merkel asked them to take some of her two million new Europeans.

Like many of us I became infatuated with Thailand when I first came and had a few quid. I'm glad I kept my wits about me and my money back home. Many elderly falangs are going to have to turn their lives around and that can be very traumatic when you're getting on a bit in years. In the UK our illustrious Home Secretary Sajid Javid won't be laying out any red carpets for returning ex pats either especially if you're a native Briton!

As Home Secretary Javid will be deciding who he is going to be allowing into his country and under what conditions.

Edited February 4, 2019 by yogi100

[jacko 8,822]

5 hours ago, GeeGee said:

My understanding was that you can combine both sources of income eg. if you proved a monthly income of say B30,000 (Amounts to B360,000 / year), then it would only be necessary to keep B800,000 - B360,000 in the bank ie. B440,000.

That's what the KeyVisa Retirement Calculator suggests.

 

Yes, I believe so for retirement extensions. It just seems to be extra complicated to verify both components. In the past many may have been put off by the requirement to get Embassy letters and Bank letters. This may be the saving route for those with smaller pensions, ie a UK State pension which is probably about 20,000baht / month. At the moment I could not figure out how combination wrt how much you have to maintain in the bank for seasoning and festering.. The 65.000 pcm figure is likely a lot more than many non-mongering retirees need. 

Edited February 4, 2019 by jacko

[Kev 178]

Just out of curiosity what happens if a bank goes bust and your $800K disappears somewhere into the coffers?

[atlas2 4,329]

What happens if you get sick and need to dip into the 400,000 for a short time in the period before you deposit your 800,000 for seasoning? 

[forcebwithu 4,856]

2 hours ago, Kev said:

Just out of curiosity what happens if a bank goes bust and your $800K disappears somewhere into the coffers?

Deposits are insured up to 1 million THB.

http://www.dpa.or.th/ewt_news.php?nid=320&filename=index___EN

 

[jacko 8,822]

4 hours ago, Kev said:

Just out of curiosity what happens if a bank goes bust and your $800K disappears somewhere into the coffers?

There is a government protection or insurance scheme which covers more than 800,000 baht.

Edited February 5, 2019 by jacko

[jacko 8,822]

4 hours ago, atlas2 said:

What happens if you get sick and need to dip into the 400,000 for a short time in the period before you deposit your 800,000 for seasoning? 

You have to plan ahead, keep 800k all year round, and if you get sick ensure it is in months 4-10,  and it doesn't cost more than 400,000 baht, and be ready to replace whatever it does cost.

[yogi100 1,925]

What happens to the 800K you've got in the Kasikorn Bank if you suddenly drop dead and have made no will nor arrangements for friends or family to gain access to it.

It happened to a pal of mine who had  1.5 million in the KB who suddenly died of a heart attack. I'm not going to say where that 1.5 M went but I'm sure you can hazard a guess.

[jacko 8,822]

25 minutes ago, yogi100 said:

What happens to the 800K you've got in the Kasikorn Bank if you suddenly drop dead and have made no will nor arrangements for friends or family to gain access to it.

It happened to a pal of mine who had  1.5 million in the KB who suddenly died of a heart attack. I'm not going to say where that 1.5 M went but I'm sure you can hazard a guess.

I doubt the bank would be aware and it may fall into the idle or dormant account category and be subject to charges until depleted. I might not be surprised if some enterprising bank employee was on the watch-out for these and may cause a different result!

[yogi100 1,925]

2 hours ago, jacko said:

I doubt the bank would be aware and it may fall into the idle or dormant account category and be subject to charges until depleted. I might not be surprised if some enterprising bank employee was on the watch-out for these and may cause a different result!

Who are the first people who are authorised to visit your abode if or when you snuff it?

Say no more. Wink wink nudge nudge.

Edited February 5, 2019 by yogi100

[capdagde 1,954]

This is an interesting thread.  Thanks for sharing.

Can anyone help me on this question?  If Flo and I were to retire to Thailand as a couple, how much would the "year-round" or "monthly income" bank amounts be?

Retirement is not far away so.....

[jacko 8,822]

7 minutes ago, capdagde said:

This is an interesting thread.  Thanks for sharing.

Can anyone help me on this question?  If Flo and I were to retire to Thailand as a couple, how much would the "year-round" or "monthly income" bank amounts be?

Retirement is not far away so.....

Two options, independent retirement extensions or one with your wife piggy backing on yours with no financial requirement. Bank amounts per OP.

[jacko 8,822]

2 hours ago, yogi100 said:

Who are the first people who are authorised to visit your abode if or when you snuff it?

Say no more. Wink wink nudge nudge.

Yes, good point, I was being naive.